Overused Protagonist Powers

T.K._Paradox

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When it comes to mage or magic users protagonists what do you think is the most overused magic type for them; and how would you change how said magic works to make it more interesting.
 

Jemini

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Magic powers.

Easy. 3 of the 4 elements. Water, fire, and wind.

Earth is, interestingly enough, rarely an element used by the protagonist of the story. Whenever it is used, it is usually used by the "heavy hitter" of the group, and roughly half the time it is WAY freaking OP. (Which is probably the reason it's almost never given to the protagonist. There are the people who lack imagination, and thus under-power the earth element, which means they don't want to give it to the protagonist. Or, it could be a writer with plenty of imagination who knows exactly how OP the earth element can be, which means they don't want to give it to the protagonist because that would be giving their protagonist too much power.)
 
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SailusGebel

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Magic powers.
Then I would say that summoning\necromancy is overused as a side magic\job. Maybe it's just me, but I happen to stumble upon stories where mc is and will be a solo fighter, yet he\she gets to summon stuff. However, this ability is never the main one, and mc will never be a punching bag without summons, which is sad.
 

D1noSlayer

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Might be a weird one, but high charisma? Maybe I've read too much harem smut but it seems like protagonists frequently get charisma related superpowers/skills that makes their integration much more seamless.
 

T.K._Paradox

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Might be a weird one, but high charisma? Maybe I've read too much harem smut but it seems like protagonists frequently get charisma related superpowers/skills that makes their integration much more seamless.
"Imagine building reasonable relationships" -- Most Harem Smut writers.
 

Zirrboy

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Easy. 3 of the 4 elements. Water, fire, and wind.

Earth is, interestingly enough, rarely an element used by the protagonist of the story. Whenever it is used, it is usually used by the "heavy hitter" of the group, and roughly half the time it is WAY freaking OP. (Which is probably the reason it's almost never given to the protagonist. There are the people who lack imagination, and thus under-power the earth element, which means they don't want to give it to the protagonist. Or, it could be a writer with plenty of imagination who knows exactly how OP the earth element can be, which means they don't want to give it to the protagonist because that would be giving their protagonist too much power.)
You can make out any element to be OP with a few tweaks to the system.

I don't think it's about the imagination to make it powerful, but rather that of the four, earth appears the most dirty and brutish.
 

ConansWitchBaby

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Lots of fire and necromancy.

For fire I'd make the change simple. Let it actually burn stuff and be useful.

Necromancy is a bit more difficult since it tends to devolve into magic warrior 2.0. So, probably make it go back to the horde mechanics and more spiritual side of the craft.
 

SternenklarenRitter

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Item box is dreadfully overused, as well as omnilinguism. I would not say friendship is overused; extremely bloodthirsty protagonists have been popular since the middle of last decade.
 

Zirrboy

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as well as omnilinguism.
That's because no omnilinguism would mean that at least one arc is about the language barrier alone.

So aside from people who read so much isekai that they no longer enjoy what those stories usually center about (wish fulfillment), I think it's there because there's no way not to have it without having the entire story be about that.
 

BenJepheneT

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Earth is, interestingly enough, rarely an element used by the protagonist of the story. Whenever it is used, it is usually used by the "heavy hitter" of the group, and roughly half the time it is WAY freaking OP. (Which is probably the reason it's almost never given to the protagonist. There are the people who lack imagination, and thus under-power the earth element, which means they don't want to give it to the protagonist. Or, it could be a writer with plenty of imagination who knows exactly how OP the earth element can be, which means they don't want to give it to the protagonist because that would be giving their protagonist too much power.)
i second this

it's hard to balance an element when it coincides with the very ground they walk on. i'd say it's better that most earth-element representations are small-scale powers like Dirt Golems or whatever rock throwing magic they have because if authors were to play with the terrain, which isn't an unlimited resource, by the way, most would probably end up glossing over some MAJOR drawbacks.

they would have some OP MC magician form a mountain through earth magic and completely forget to mention that every village within an 8-9 mile radius just had their crops completely fucking decimated along with mass landslide threats popping up absolutely everywhere. not to mention the local habitat, the ecosystem, water sources; the whole nine yards.

poor old Joseph went to bed last night with a small paddy field in his backyard and woke up this morning to find his little cottage sitting at a 27 degree angle on the side of a hill that wasn't there yesterday.
 

Jemini

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i second this

it's hard to balance an element when it coincides with the very ground they walk on. i'd say it's better that most earth-element representations are small-scale powers like Dirt Golems or whatever rock throwing magic they have because if authors were to play with the terrain, which isn't an unlimited resource, by the way, most would probably end up glossing over some MAJOR drawbacks.

they would have some OP MC magician form a mountain through earth magic and completely forget to mention that every village within an 8-9 mile radius just had their crops completely fucking decimated along with mass landslide threats popping up absolutely everywhere. not to mention the local habitat, the ecosystem, water sources; the whole nine yards.

poor old Joseph went to bed last night with a small paddy field in his backyard and woke up this morning to find his little cottage sitting at a 27 degree angle on the side of a hill that wasn't there yesterday.

You don't even need to get that extreme to have the Earth element become completely OP.

Among the plethora of things "In Another World With my Smart Phone" did horribly wrong, there is 1 thing they got very very right. You can't fight effectively if you can't stand up straight. The protagonist's "slip" spell, a simple spell that makes the target slip, turned out to be his most OP use of magic in his entire arsenal simply because it made the toughest of warriors helpless for a moment, leaving them open to some follow-up attack.

Guess what. Earth magic can have the exact same effect simply by messing with the enemy's footing.

There's a reason why Mushoku Tensei has enemies at really high levels able to deal with Rudie's Quagmire spell, a spell that turns the ground into a swamp and mess up the enemy's footing. That spell became Rudie's signature spell simply because it's so darn effective, and pretty much wipes out any enemy below saint rank.

Messing with the enemy's footing is so OP it's ridiculous, and it really doesn't take much to do. In fact, it's so OP that it challenges the writer to come up with reasons why it DOESN'T instantly turn the entire battle in the earth mage's favor. In Avatar the Last Airbender, Toff uses this tactic when she first appears. However, to keep her from being too OP, the writers just conveniently made her forget to mess with the enemy's footing as often as she probably should be doing. In Mushoku Tensei, Rudie KNOWS messing with the enemy's footing is the 1st tactic he should always default to. And, in order to deal with it, the writer is forced to come up with methods for the enemy to overcome the tactic that start to look rather contrived in several cases, and it all boils down to "it didn't work because the writer wants some tension in the encounter," ignoring reality to make the writing good.

Ironically, that HORRIBLY written Smartphone isekai was the closest to getting it right just how OP it is to mess with the enemy's footing.
 

SailusGebel

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You don't even need to get that extreme to have the Earth element become completely OP.

Among the plethora of things "In Another World With my Smart Phone" did horribly wrong, there is 1 thing they got very very right. You can't fight effectively if you can't stand up straight. The protagonist's "slip" spell, a simple spell that makes the target slip, turned out to be his most OP use of magic in his entire arsenal simply because it made the toughest of warriors helpless for a moment, leaving them open to some follow-up attack.

Guess what. Earth magic can have the exact same effect simply by messing with the enemy's footing.

There's a reason why Mushoku Tensei has enemies at really high levels able to deal with Rudie's Quagmire spell, a spell that turns the ground into a swamp and mess up the enemy's footing. That spell became Rudie's signature spell simply because it's so darn effective, and pretty much wipes out any enemy below saint rank.

Messing with the enemy's footing is so OP it's ridiculous, and it really doesn't take much to do. In fact, it's so OP that it challenges the writer to come up with reasons why it DOESN'T instantly turn the entire battle in the earth mage's favor. In Avatar the Last Airbender, Toff uses this tactic when she first appears. However, to keep her from being too OP, the writers just conveniently made her forget to mess with the enemy's footing as often as she probably should be doing. In Mushoku Tensei, Rudie KNOWS messing with the enemy's footing is the 1st tactic he should always default to. And, in order to deal with it, the writer is forced to come up with methods for the enemy to overcome the tactic that start to look rather contrived in several cases, and it all boils down to "it didn't work because the writer wants some tension in the encounter," ignoring reality to make the writing good.

Ironically, that HORRIBLY written Smartphone isekai was the closest to getting it right just how OP it is to mess with the enemy's footing.
What else makes earth magic OP? I'm genuinely curious, no offense meant.
 

Zirrboy

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You don't even need to get that extreme to have the Earth element become completely OP.

Among the plethora of things "In Another World With my Smart Phone" did horribly wrong, there is 1 thing they got very very right. You can't fight effectively if you can't stand up straight. The protagonist's "slip" spell, a simple spell that makes the target slip, turned out to be his most OP use of magic in his entire arsenal simply because it made the toughest of warriors helpless for a moment, leaving them open to some follow-up attack.

Guess what. Earth magic can have the exact same effect simply by messing with the enemy's footing.

There's a reason why Mushoku Tensei has enemies at really high levels able to deal with Rudie's Quagmire spell, a spell that turns the ground into a swamp and mess up the enemy's footing. That spell became Rudie's signature spell simply because it's so darn effective, and pretty much wipes out any enemy below saint rank.

Messing with the enemy's footing is so OP it's ridiculous, and it really doesn't take much to do. In fact, it's so OP that it challenges the writer to come up with reasons why it DOESN'T instantly turn the entire battle in the earth mage's favor. In Avatar the Last Airbender, Toff uses this tactic when she first appears. However, to keep her from being too OP, the writers just conveniently made her forget to mess with the enemy's footing as often as she probably should be doing. In Mushoku Tensei, Rudie KNOWS messing with the enemy's footing is the 1st tactic he should always default to. And, in order to deal with it, the writer is forced to come up with methods for the enemy to overcome the tactic that start to look rather contrived in several cases, and it all boils down to "it didn't work because the writer wants some tension in the encounter," ignoring reality to make the writing good.

Ironically, that HORRIBLY written Smartphone isekai was the closest to getting it right just how OP it is to mess with the enemy's footing.
While certainly underused, imo this strategy works so well in those cases because nobody is using it frequently. Therefore, none of the people they face expect to lose their footing.
Physical fighters probably are out of luck, but if earth magic is prevalent, others would come up with strategies to beat them.

If wind magicians can float, they're unaffected. And if earth users can alter the ground under people's feet, wind magicians would probably be able to make air wreak havoc inside other's lungs.

Water users could lift themselves in a similar manner with water they can conjure or, if not, carry along. Additionally, almost all ground contains water, so they might be able to replicate the slipping magic in a similar fashion.

Fire magicians could either come up with an aviation solution of their own, or train to cast while being thrown around.

So unless you specifically nerf them, at which point power relations are up to the author's favour, all mage duels would be sudden death matches.
 

Jemini

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What else makes earth magic OP? I'm genuinely curious, no offense meant.

Interestingly, one of the more OP aspects of earth magic is increased gravity. Specifically, and this is one almost NOBODY ever thinks about, is using increased gravity as a buffing effect.

Basically, this goes down to how people started bashing on oversized swords a while back. Super strength is not enough to let you swing around an oversized sword, because the torque generated by the swing would take you right off your feet.

This effect can be compensated for if you increase your own weight. If you weigh more, you can swing around heavier objects as you use them as weapons. Imagine bringing a tree-size sword to a fight and cutting down an entire formation at once.

This is one of many things OP about earth magic.

Another one would be attacking enemy infrastructure. When it comes to warfare, breaking the enemy's roads, water-lines, power-lines, bridges, walls, and military fortifications is something that can turn the tide of an entire war effort.

Now, all 4 elements have ways of demolishing these things. However, earth just so happens to be the most efficient for the job, putting in the least amount of effort for the greatest result. It can take down enemy infrastructure over the widest scale at the fastest speed while expending the least amount of energy in the effort.

Also, if you are going with making gravity an advanced form of earth magic, and you also allow it access to the ability to reduce gravity, reduced gravity magic can actually be used as another way to un-foot your opponent. This is just as counter-intuitive, but it makes perfect sense when you actually stop to consider it. A lot of people tend to think being lighter means it's easier to move around. But, it also means it's easier for others to move YOU. So, reduce your enemy's weight. As soon as you do that, their attacks will no longer do as much damage to you, but anything you do to them will blow them away like you are blowing away a feather.

It will make your opponent practically helpless. And, it would be quite the way to mess with any of the self-propulsion methods @Zirrboy mentioned the other elements could employ. If their weight suddenly reduces but they haven't reduced their propulsion, their flight will suddenly become very unsteady. If it's one of those magic systems where you have to concentrate, being hit with a low gravity spell could even be enough to disrupt your spell in progress.

(Also, high gravity as an attack would be effective, but as a trope it's an attack method that's defeated almost 100% of the time by the grit and determination of the person being targeted by it. It's an uninteresting method of attack, and very predictable how it's going to be defeated, so it's recommended not to use this particular method in your writing.)
 

SailusGebel

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Interestingly, one of the more OP aspects of earth magic is increased gravity. Specifically, and this is one almost NOBODY ever thinks about, is using increased gravity as a buffing effect.

Basically, this goes down to how people started bashing on oversized swords a while back. Super strength is not enough to let you swing around an oversized sword, because the torque generated by the swing would take you right off your feet.

This effect can be compensated for if you increase your own weight. If you weigh more, you can swing around heavier objects as you use them as weapons. Imagine bringing a tree-size sword to a fight and cutting down an entire formation at once.

This is one of many things OP about earth magic.

Another one would be attacking enemy infrastructure. When it comes to warfare, breaking the enemy's roads, water-lines, power-lines, bridges, walls, and military fortifications is something that can turn the tide of an entire war effort.

Now, all 4 elements have ways of demolishing these things. However, earth just so happens to be the most efficient for the job, putting in the least amount of effort for the greatest result. It can take down enemy infrastructure over the widest scale at the fastest speed while expending the least amount of energy in the effort.

Also, if you are going with making gravity an advanced form of earth magic, and you also allow it access to the ability to reduce gravity, reduced gravity magic can actually be used as another way to un-foot your opponent. This is just as counter-intuitive, but it makes perfect sense when you actually stop to consider it. A lot of people tend to think being lighter means it's easier to move around. But, it also means it's easier for others to move YOU. So, reduce your enemy's weight. As soon as you do that, their attacks will no longer do as much damage to you, but anything you do to them will blow them away like you are blowing away a feather.

It will make your opponent practically helpless. And, it would be quite the way to mess with any of the self-propulsion methods @Zirrboy mentioned the other elements could employ. If their weight suddenly reduces but they haven't reduced their propulsion, their flight will suddenly become very unsteady. If it's one of those magic systems where you have to concentrate, being hit with a low gravity spell could even be enough to disrupt your spell in progress.

(Also, high gravity as an attack would be effective, but as a trope it's an attack method that's defeated almost 100% of the time by the grit and determination of the person being targeted by it. It's an uninteresting method of attack, and very predictable how it's going to be defeated, so it's recommended not to use this particular method in your writing.)
Honestly, I don't think that gravity is a part of the earth magic. Demolishing things is easier, true. But, it's not that op if we are talking about one-on-one action or small scale, group fights.
 

Lorelliad

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As the many above me have said, Earth magic. Usually whenever I come across a protagonist who is proficient in elemental magic, he's usually a fire or water, with the former occuring the most. Probably because fire is known for its destructive power.

If its not one, its usually all of them. "Jack of all trades", I think it was called.

But Earth is strong too, you know. That's why I can appreciate protagonists who primarily use Earth magic, like Rudeus Greyrat from Mushoku Tensei, with one of the spells that he use a lot, is just Rock Bullets. But he's learned to cast them so quickly and potently that its now a machinegun, or rather a shotgun, if he wants it to be.

One more thing, he literally makes multiple mech suits to amplify the rock bullets even FURTHER.
 
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