How to address different skin tones when writting

hauntedwritings

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You have two options:

1. Don't care about people's opinions and write what you want. Your story will never be able to please everyone, anyway.

2. Avoid writing character appearances in ways that relates to things such as skin colour. Instead, empthasize the difference between nationalities by the characters' cultural upbringing. After all, our stereotypes of what people from different countries are extends beyond the population's general appearances.
 

BenJepheneT

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2. Avoid writing character appearances in ways that relates to things such as skin colour. Instead, empthasize the difference between nationalities by the characters' cultural upbringing. After all, our stereotypes of what people from different countries are extends beyond the population's general appearances.
Wouldn't it be some hilarious Freudian slip when an author goes "yeah I should probably avoid skin colour and just go with the general descriptors" and ends up writing "she has eyes as thin as slits and rolls her Rs into Ls whenever she talks"?

"HE HAS BIG LIPS AND IS VERY FOND OF WATERMELONS AND FRIED CHICKEN" before being succeeded with "HE ALSO HAS PALE, MILKY SKIN" to throw off readers in the know lmao
 

yansusustories

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According to this article I read a while ago, that's a no-no:

no-no (see above)
Funnily enough, I recently read an article on a black-owned website targeted at black people, and most of the descriptions for skin tones they use are food-related. So if black people use those comparisons and are proud of having that skin tone, I think it is more than alright to use them ourselves. Sure, some might have a problem with it but honestly, we can't do everything right for everyone. It's not like black people are a hive mind that will all agree on what descriptors they'd like to see or not.

Btw, in case anyone is interested in the shades they described, this is the article: https://www.thatsister.com/different-shades-of-brown-skin-which-do-you-have/
 
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BenJepheneT

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Funnily enough, I recently read an article on a black-owned website targeted at black people, and most of the descriptions for skin tones they use are food-related. So if black people use those comparisons and are proud of having that skin tone, I'd personally find it worse to ignore that because a white author thinks it's racist.

Btw, in case anyone is interested in the shades they described, this is the article: https://www.thatsister.com/different-shades-of-brown-skin-which-do-you-have/
I'm sorry but between 1 to 8 just looks the same to me. I don't know if it's some internalized racism cultivated by living in a third-world household but if you put a gun against my head and told me to differentiate Peanut Butter Truffle Tone from Browned Caramel Skin Shade I'd shoot myself to save you the trouble.

And, not to be rude, but Delicious Cacao Black Skin Shade sounds like some fetish advertising in a food-themed brothel at the Red Light District.

"And over here, we have our ripe, Oriental Pickings. Would you like our Stir-Fry Chow Fan or our Store-Exclusive Bak Kut Teh?"
 

yansusustories

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I'm sorry but between 1 to 8 just looks the same to me. I don't know if it's some internalized racism cultivated by living in a third-world household but if you put a gun against my head and told me to differentiate Peanut Butter Truffle Tone from Browned Caramel Skin Shade I'd shoot myself to save you the trouble.

And, not to be rude, but Delicious Cacao Black Skin Shade sounds like some fetish advertising in a food-themed brothel at the Red Light District.

"And over here, we have our ripe, Oriental Pickings. Would you like our Stir-Fry Chow Fan or our Store-Exclusive Bak Kut Teh?"
As somebody who has trouble differentiating shades of colors in general, I do get you. Some of them are really same-ish. I think a lot of this specific skin tone stuff comes from makeup though where smaller differences are important to match your own skin so I see why they'd differentiate so much.
 

hauntedwritings

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Wouldn't it be some hilarious Freudian slip when an author goes "yeah I should probably avoid skin colour and just go with the general descriptors" and ends up writing "she has eyes as thin as slits and rolls her Rs into Ls whenever she talks"?

"HE HAS BIG LIPS AND IS VERY FOND OF WATERMELONS AND FRIED CHICKEN" before being succeeded with "HE ALSO HAS PALE, MILKY SKIN" to throw off readers in the know lmao
Sorry, I'm a bit confused. I suggested to avoid that kind of general descriptions completely (skin colour being one of them).

Personally, I feel satisfied with fewer details about characters' appearances. Too many details can make the author seem obsessed and superficial.

Crude example of what I'm suggesting: "The gangly, dark-haired gentleman wiped the non-existent dust off the embroidered national sigil that was on the chest of his formal attire, as well as those next to him." We get a short description of what the character looks like, but its not enough to tie to any stereotypes. Instead, the descriptions focus on something else - the character's attitude. In this case, patriotism - a likely result of the culture.

The writer can never introduce enough characters to bring an entire people justice, but has to use one or a few characters as representatives of that people. And I think putting words on generalizing the appearance of that people is a waste of time and effort, when there's more important things to highlight.
___

I suppose if you chose to mix different stereotypes to throw off the readers, it could be something some readers find amusing, however.
 

BenJepheneT

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Sorry, I'm a bit confused. I suggested to avoid that kind of general descriptions completely (skin colour being one of them).

Personally, I feel satisfied with fewer details about characters' appearances. Too many details can make the author seem obsessed and superficial.

Crude example of what I'm suggesting: "The gangly, dark-haired gentleman wiped the non-existent dust off the embroidered national sigil that was on the chest of his formal attire, as well as those next to him." We get a short description of what the character looks like, but its not enough to tie to any stereotypes. Instead, the descriptions focus on something else - the character's attitude. In this case, patriotism - a likely result of the culture.

The writer can never introduce enough characters to bring an entire people justice, but has to use one or a few characters as representatives of that people. And I think putting words on generalizing the appearance of that people is a waste of time and effort, when there's more important things to highlight.
___

I suppose if you chose to mix different stereotypes to throw off the readers, it could be something some readers find amusing, however.
as pleasing as this prospect seems to be, at the end of the day, readers would most likely be able to effectively paint an image of a character if skin colour was given. it's like the fourth most effective element of describing a person behind their attire, body type, and a straight-up illustration of how they look like.

depending on how you want your character to look or how you wish them to be perceived by your readers, you might sometimes end up with the audience painting a completely different image from how you described your character.

as an example, according to your crude description, I could potentially see that "gangly, dark-haired gentleman" portrayed by 3 different races. I'm not saying it's a crucial descriptor to put down, but from my own reading experience, it's better to gradually paint that distinct image for your character to stand out, and one of the most effective elements for that is, as stated, skin colour. this extends towards beastkins and fantasy races too.

plus, you'd be missing out on the "dark skin reflecting the moonlight with a near-chrome shine" esque descriptions that are hella fun to pull off.

like I said, it isn't crucial, but it's hell of a lot better to have it than to not.
 

K5Rakitan

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I just feel like this is overcorrection, especially the food part. Unless you're consciously associating lighter skin tones with good things and vice versa, there's definitely no issue with describing skin colour with food. White as cocaine, dark as chocolate, peachy tone, light brown tinge; if anything the connotations are taken out by the readers themselves instead of just assuming the surface comparison.

If I have to be frank, this article just hinders authors more and will probably cause some awkward and cringey proses in an effort to avoid these "casually racist" things when using them presents no issue whatsoever.

Aside from 1, 3, 5, and 6, the others are complete non-issues.

Umm. you can describe white skin with food colours too? creamy and milky quickly come to mind.
And honestly, the article feels like it tries to overcorrect too much. Even rule 1, - yes if you are writing about NY setting I would expect variable races. But if you are writing about a completely fictional world why should you be including all earth races as well? What if that world has dragons and only black people? what if the sun in that world is too harsh and all people with pale skin never appeared at all? It all sounds like forcible diversity.

Funnily enough, I recently read an article on a black-owned website targeted at black people, and most of the descriptions for skin tones they use are food-related. So if black people use those comparisons and are proud of having that skin tone, I think it is more than alright to use them ourselves. Sure, some might have a problem with it but honestly, we can't do everything right for everyone. It's not like black people are a hive mind that will all agree on what descriptors they'd like to see or not.

Btw, in case anyone is interested in the shades they described, this is the article: https://www.thatsister.com/different-shades-of-brown-skin-which-do-you-have/
This all describes how I feel when people tell me I can't use "prostitute" to refer to a full-service sex worker. Another whore once interviewed me for her master's thesis. She didn't have a problem with being called a prostitute, either.
 

longer

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This all describes how I feel when people tell me I can't use "prostitute" to refer to a full-service sex worker. Another whore once interviewed me for her master's thesis. She didn't have a problem with being called a prostitute, either.
Wait, if we can't use prostitute what the hell are we supposed to call them? Street-side servicers? Professional ball handlers? Paid nymphomaniacs? Genital masseurs? It's not as though all sex workers are prostitutes, since I know that strippers are also considered sex workers.

On a side note, genital masseurs are not sex workers, but just specialized masseurs. I just made the joke since I once hired a hooker by accident when I went to get a massage in my native country. Like sex is nice, but you ever have someone rub all the aches out of your back?
 

Snusmumriken

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This all describes how I feel when people tell me I can't use "prostitute" to refer to a full-service sex worker. Another whore once interviewed me for her master's thesis. She didn't have a problem with being called a prostitute, either.
I think what really matters is context.

If the whole reason the skin colour is brought up is to describe how sexy and delicious it is I would assume anyone would be put off. But if you have an established character with dreams and wants and faculty to pursue these - I am less likely to be bothered whether the skin tone was creamy, peachy. olive, or chocolate. At that point is simply becomes a common colour reference for quick visualization in my opinion.
Just as you can take simple white and black and make them much worse by using them in the wrong context.
 

UnratedX

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According to this article I read a while ago, that's a no-no:

no-no (see above)
THANKYOU. SOMEONE needed to call out all these racist wuxia authors who never add any black characters. check your casual racism CULTIVATION AUTHORS FFS.
 

BenJepheneT

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This all describes how I feel when people tell me I can't use "prostitute" to refer to a full-service sex worker. Another whore once interviewed me for her master's thesis. She didn't have a problem with being called a prostitute, either.
Different folks different strokes, I guess. Like how some friends are chill with pet names while others preferred not to be called as such.

Problem only arises when the latter forgets their preferences aren't absolute and starts chiming over the former.

Street-side servicers? Professional ball handlers? Paid nymphomaniacs? Genital masseurs?
Hourly ball emptiers. Shaft polishers. Comfort fox holes. Human riders. Apple-bottomed social workers. Workers of an Establishment of Emotional Elevation. Pump & Dump Stations. Temporary partner. Active bed sharer. Masturbatory magistrate. Deputies of desire.

Keep it going.
 

longer

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Hourly ball emptiers. Shaft polishers. Comfort fox holes. Human riders. Apple-bottomed social workers. Workers of an Establishment of Emotional Elevation. Pump & Dump Stations. Temporary partner. Active bed sharer. Masturbatory magistrate. Deputies of desire.

Keep it going.
In other words, the close relatives of someone that disagrees with me.
 

Cipiteca396

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THANKYOU. SOMEONE needed to call out all these racist wuxia authors who never add any black characters. check your casual racism CULTIVATION AUTHORS FFS.
Isn't cultivation as a genre far east themed? Why would there be any black characters in it? It would be like putting White Europeans in historical fiction set in Ancient Africa. Sure, maybe a Mycenaean sailed to Carthage and managed to get kidnapped and brought a thousand miles inland... But that's kinda weird anyways.

 

LostLibrarian

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Honestly - You can't win. There will always be someone who is offended, no matter the lengths you go.

RWBY copied the animal girls slave trope from anime and it became a topic because PoC in America were called animals. No regards towards why it was there or how japanese tropes developed, just a racism outcry...


So - obvious racism aside - honestly the best course of action is to just treat all skin colors the same. Describe the skin color of every character and don't skip it for all white people. Use neutral descriptions (would you call white people milk colored?) or try a theme without clear judgements, e.g. flowers. And don't use weeds for some colors.

Just make colors another description without pushing too much attention to it. Be respectful, think whether you would be offended, and if not and google's first search result isn't racial slur, you should be fine. And just be open to feedback.

From my experience, a lot of times the problem isn't an adjective but the overall writing of the character. Don't make that skin color special in itself, have only one black person and that is the typical black friend character. Don't use skin color for unnecessary jokes or a one dimensional character trope.

Just write and describe people of color like you would treat white people in your books. Too much special attention can make it feel more racist by accident or even destroy a story when you try to please everyone.

Just don't be an asshole...
 
D

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For that one person that commented on something like this...
I think if you force diversity in certain settings that just doesn't really leave a lot room for it, it doesn't do well.
Ex: Historically 13th century England? Or ancient times in an east asian country. What do you think majority of that population is like at that time?

Now if like the setting is fantasy (such as one completely created by the author and not really based on a setting that sort of limits them in certain ways, then that can leave them more freedom to create and include more diversity as they wish) or like modern day set in locations with more diversity (certain countries, international cities, etc.), then yes, its much more easier to happen and can totally see how different groups are written into the story.

I do like to see characters that are diverse and can relate to. Partly the reason why wanted to start writing. However, it depends on how they incorporate it. Sometimes it comes off cringey if not worse, depending how the author does it. And that also scares a lot of potential authors who wish to include diversity or different cultures too. Its all kinda grey and just depends how its done at the end of the day.

That, and we tend to write what we are comfortable with and the type of society we interact with often. Forcing diversity in just for sake of diversity may make it hard to read, even when its adding characters that may relate to us in appearance, but their personality and character is either invisible or just ~~~. Adding diversity if it works for that story, and adding depth to the characters is better.

As for different skin tones, I think one of these days if ever decide to pursue stories where characters have multicultural backgrounds, then maybe I would also try to look into that more too. So far, some of the stories had in mind are more centered on a particular type of culture(s), although people within that culture can also come in various shades of color. I have read some characters in novels where they describe the character as honey or wheat colored perplexion besides the common pale and smooth as a jade kind of thing.

By the way there is no sure way to describe skin color. Some ideas (idk how good it is but Writing POC 101 was one of those stories i bookmarked for better reference and reminder awhile back. Write Diversity is something just looked up, so idk how good it is).
 
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yansusustories

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This all describes how I feel when people tell me I can't use "prostitute" to refer to a full-service sex worker. Another whore once interviewed me for her master's thesis. She didn't have a problem with being called a prostitute, either.
I think I saw you mention that somewhere before. Honestly, I don't quite get that either but then again, I think being a prostitute is a job pretty much like any other one. You provide a service, people pay for it. I never really got the stigma around it. With this kind of thing, I always go by "in a book, you can call it what you think fits" (since that also relies a lot on the context of the story) but "if it's about a person and they prefer to be called whatever, then you use whatever for them".
 

_oinkchan

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Softly Whispers: *I know, portuguese & spanish as well are extremely dumb, thinking we own the world when we the size of small grape. And I'll tell you even more, the second canditate for our presidency this year is a guy that is a mini donald trump meets nazi. Scary to think that he almost won just to "purify the country" #disgusting*


Yeah, like I said it wasn't really my intention to insult anyone by saying that word. I only thought it was alright because everyone uses it (notice: my school was like only 30% snowman people so that might have been one of the reasons as well).


Thank you for the suggestions!


Well I didn't used to care but now, no matter what you say, even if you say it naively or purely because you are ignorant and lack knowledge, you will always end up being seen poorly just for speaking about these themes. I am just trying to understand what is alright and what isn't (yes I did search google but as fellow authors and readers, you might have your own opinions on the matter).


Thank you for your suggestion as well!


Thank you very much for your input! This is the first time I see "jade" being used like this!
Thank you very much for your input! This is the first time I see "jade" being used like this
You need Jesus!! Heresy for never reading cnovels!
 
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