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TheTrinary

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Hey, I'm wondering what you think of my first chapter?
It may not be something you like as it's a slice of life/romance but let me know if you decide to critique it! :)
Link? It's a pain to get to your profile on the main site from here.
The thing I'm going for utilizing the use of a hyphen monologue is that whenever the hyphen appears, you'll immediately know it's the main character's internal monologue.

Everyone's calling him that, meaning, everyone recognizes him as that.

I'm setting the mother up as eccentric.

Herein lies my issue. My first chapter is the introductory part of a small three-act structure, where I've introduced my character, his personality, and a few points of what's to come. And continues on to chapter 4 (three-act but cut into four parts lol)
I've lowered my word count to around 1000 per chapter to pace it but if readers really are extremely critical to the first chapter, should I just combine the first four chapters into one, you think?
I don't think chapter length or break down really matters, so long as each chapter can stand on it's own. 1k words if fine, and while it would be difficult to squeeze everything you may want into such a chapter, it's totally doable.

What I think doesn't work as well is if you write a 4k word chapter and then release it in 4 separate parts. Web novels favor smaller chapters, but it favors smaller chapters that are complete on their own. I might not be the best person to talk about it, since I don't love the format in the first place, but that's where i'm at on the issue.
 

EddieSeb

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Link? It's a pain to get to your profile on the main site from here.

I don't think chapter length or break down really matters, so long as each chapter can stand on it's own. 1k words if fine, and while it would be difficult to squeeze everything you may want into such a chapter, it's totally doable.

What I think doesn't work as well is if you write a 4k word chapter and then release it in 4 separate parts. Web novels favor smaller chapters, but it favors smaller chapters that are complete on their own. I might not be the best person to talk about it, since I don't love the format in the first place, but that's where i'm at on the issue.
I didn't know! Here it is:

 

TheTrinary

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I didn't know! Here it is:

Would not keep reading.

First prose. The writing itself is good, but your tense use was. . odd You pair present tense with past perfect tense and as far as style goes, I don't think it works. Present tenses evokes a stream of consciousness, happening now, light and snappy tone. Past perfect is the opposite of that. There's no reason to use past perfect over simple past for 95% of the sentences you use.

And writing this out, I feel a bit obtuse to complain about this of all things, but reading it back it really is jarring. Combing in the moment with as removed as possible doesn't feel right. I'm curious why you wrote it this way. Have you read something else that combined these two tenses? If you know something written like this that you thought was good, go ahead and send me a line and tell me what it is because I'd be interested to see.

Outside of the prose, I think you do an ample job building up the MC. It's really all this first chapter is. For what this kind of book is, I think it's professional to that level (small self published).

I think your second problem arises with the overall chapter construction and structure. Like I said, you character work was really good, but it isn't so good that it can completely prop up an entire chapter on it's own. It can be, and probably should be for you, the focus, but something more needs to be built onto the foundation.

So let's talk about that. Half a second before you described Lucas, I said "Okay now we find out about the wacky new roommate that turns her life upside down." I was correct in terms of pacing, good on you there, but I was incorrect in premise. Insomuch, there isn't a premise or hook? A story starts with a departure from the normal. It doesn't have to be in the first chapter but the sooner the better. In your case, the entire chapter revolved around that departure. She's lost her roommate. Everything is going to change.

But. Then. Not really. She has a new respectable roommate.

What's the story about?

I thought it could go one of two ways:
1) She's desperate for a roommate and let's someone in completely different from her who will turn her life upside down.
2) It's a romantic thing. She thought she found a roommate but actually it's the love of her life.

But here's the thing: I had to read the description to find that out. I think it's a problem when someone reading your first chapter in a vacuum can't even tell what genre it is.

Now let's talk about romance and the genre.

Romance is probably one of the most inherently personal things you can write about. It's all about relationships and how people feel. The writing should reflect that.

So how did your MC and your love interest meet. How did they build their relationship? Eh. We get a few statements in the past tense where she describes him and how they met. It's like a laundry list. I hope you are familiar with the term Meet Cute, because this it ain't.

And here's where my critique and advice has limits because I don't know how the rest of the book is set up and structured. Maybe there is a good reason that she knew him before hand. Maybe having a pre existing relationship will play into things. And let's say it is important. Even if they have met before, this is not a strong way to introduce a love interest.

What if instead, you use that history to have Johnathan recommend an A/C repair man. He comes to the apartment. They talk. You establish some time of chemistry, and he mentions apartment hunting. Boom she asks him to move in then and there because she's desperate. We, as the readers, get to see things unfold like a story.

So that's about it. I went as about in depth as I could since you seem to take yourself a little more seriously than a lot of the people on here. HMU if you have any questions.
 

Alkareel

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I don't think chapter length or break down really matters, so long as each chapter can stand on it's own. 1k words if fine, and while it would be difficult to squeeze everything you may want into such a chapter, it's totally doable.

What I think doesn't work as well is if you write a 4k word chapter and then release it in 4 separate parts. Web novels favor smaller chapters, but it favors smaller chapters that are complete on their own. I might not be the best person to talk about it, since I don't love the format in the first place, but that's where i'm at on the issue.
Hmmm... That makes sense. Though in the first place I limited chapters into 1000k words so that it'll make it easier for me to pace, as well as for readers to go to the next page. Though it also works against me as readers are critical of the first chapter. Oh well. This has been insightful, thank you.
 

TheTrinary

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This is my first time writing a novel and I'm kinda concerned with how I'm presenting the setting. I'd really appreciate any feedback you have to offer!
scribblehub.com/series/300449/threaded-skies/
Yeah it's just way too much. You have the sense of it when you asked for feedback on presenting the setting, but I think it goes deeper than that. The issue isn't just setting but also the characters and their history.

The first issue I see is the shape of the story– it's structure. You start off your first chapter with a lengthy conversation between two people. . . and that's it. Let's ignore for a second that you then use this setup to exposit a crap load of dialogue. Even if this had been a normal modern day set up with no weirdness for the audience to work through, I still don't think it works.

The set up reminds me of a noir detective story. This is the scene where a dame walks into the office and asks the out of luck. Except that isn't the first scene in a noir story, it's the second. Pretty universally, the first story beat is a scene that demonstrates 1) The main character's virtues and skills, and 2) the he is out of luck and needs a break.

There are plenty of these types of stories that skip the first beat, but they add it in later because the entire story is told non-linear.

Now, I don't know what kind of story you are telling. It's obviously not noir, but it probably isn't a mystery or detective story either. But, and it's a big but, if you're going to borrow this opening style for your sci-fi, you should probably go all the way and present it as they do. There's a reason the client meeting follows an introductory scene universally. It 1) establishes the world, 2) establishes the main character. That way when you have an entire scene where the plot is laid out, we aren't overwhelmed.

As is, we are trying to understand this complex sci fi world, all the characters, and all the plot all at once, in one boring scene with two people talking to each other.

So for a very introductory, easy way to start this story, make this your chapter 2 and include a chapter 1 that lets you establish the Main Character in a strong way, and establish the world enough that the chapter 2 exposition isn't jarring.

Outside of this, I think the level of detail you put forth in some places is just too much. If something can be simplified, it should be early on. You don't need to talk about different divisions and arms bands and all that. It isn't Branch 2, it's "the sciene lab/corp." It isn't "anchor world" and clowwork swarm" it's science lab is trying to secure to the future of humanity off planet.

See what I mean?

And then in chapter 3 he goes to the lab and they give him his arm band. He asks, hey where are we sending people to off planet? Oh an anchor world? Oh there's this clockwork swarm. Gottit.
 

malgeroth

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Yeah it's just way too much. You have the sense of it when you asked for feedback on presenting the setting, but I think it goes deeper than that. The issue isn't just setting but also the characters and their history.

The first issue I see is the shape of the story– it's structure. You start off your first chapter with a lengthy conversation between two people. . . and that's it. Let's ignore for a second that you then use this setup to exposit a crap load of dialogue. Even if this had been a normal modern day set up with no weirdness for the audience to work through, I still don't think it works.

The set up reminds me of a noir detective story. This is the scene where a dame walks into the office and asks the out of luck. Except that isn't the first scene in a noir story, it's the second. Pretty universally, the first story beat is a scene that demonstrates 1) The main character's virtues and skills, and 2) the he is out of luck and needs a break.

There are plenty of these types of stories that skip the first beat, but they add it in later because the entire story is told non-linear.

Now, I don't know what kind of story you are telling. It's obviously not noir, but it probably isn't a mystery or detective story either. But, and it's a big but, if you're going to borrow this opening style for your sci-fi, you should probably go all the way and present it as they do. There's a reason the client meeting follows an introductory scene universally. It 1) establishes the world, 2) establishes the main character. That way when you have an entire scene where the plot is laid out, we aren't overwhelmed.

As is, we are trying to understand this complex sci fi world, all the characters, and all the plot all at once, in one boring scene with two people talking to each other.

So for a very introductory, easy way to start this story, make this your chapter 2 and include a chapter 1 that lets you establish the Main Character in a strong way, and establish the world enough that the chapter 2 exposition isn't jarring.

Outside of this, I think the level of detail you put forth in some places is just too much. If something can be simplified, it should be early on. You don't need to talk about different divisions and arms bands and all that. It isn't Branch 2, it's "the sciene lab/corp." It isn't "anchor world" and clowwork swarm" it's science lab is trying to secure to the future of humanity off planet.

See what I mean?

And then in chapter 3 he goes to the lab and they give him his arm band. He asks, hey where are we sending people to off planet? Oh an anchor world? Oh there's this clockwork swarm. Gottit.
Thanks for the feedback.
 
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Underload

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Heir of mana

I read your analysis of others, and I am wondering if the first chapter of my story starts too slow. What do you think?
 

nanchengnv

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A little R-18, especially towards the end of the first chapter. But I'd appreciate the feedback.
Also, what should be considered a prologue? For the most part, my prologue is disconnected from the timeline of the rest of the story so far as well. Am I using the prologue right? Should it actually be chapter 1? You don't have to read it. It's as I said, it's a battle scene that kind of introduces part of the MC's character.
https://www.scribblehub.com/read/301482-im-not-like-those-other-jadelike-beauties/chapter/303448/
 
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TheTrinary

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Heir of mana

I read your analysis of others, and I am wondering if the first chapter of my story starts too slow. What do you think?
Would keep reading.

I quite liked that. You write well and I didn't feel the pacing was an issue. With that said, Litpg's normally are a bit quicker and blunter so you're going against the grain of what people want in a genre that's all about quick satisfaction. It's a bit more novel-y than normal. But on personal preferance I much preffered it to the standard writing.

Two things.

First isn't really a critique, your formatting is just off and it hurts my eyes a bit. Look at the spacing. Copy and pasting into these sites is a pain I know, but it'd be nice if you could fix it.

And then the only slight critique I have is just that the first couple of paragraphs are a bit overwritten– something I never say around here. I thought at first that was just your style and if it was consistent that would be one thing, but it seems like you just really wanted to beef up the opening with some really flowery prose.

Anyway, good job.
A little R-18, especially towards the end of the first chapter. But I'd appreciate the feedback.
Also, what should be considered a prologue? For the most part, my prologue is disconnected from the timeline of the rest of the story so far as well. Am I using the prologue right? Should it actually be chapter 1? You don't have to read it. It's as I said, it's a battle scene that kind of introduces part of the MC's character.
https://www.scribblehub.com/read/301482-im-not-like-those-other-jadelike-beauties/chapter/303448/
So disconnected prologue is a pretty standard way of doing it. I eyed it over, seems fine.

Uh while it's not my kind of thing personally, from the prospective of someone who likes these stories, would keep reading.

There's not a whole bunch to say here. It's well written. Well executed. Just all around competent. I have to step back and say "not for me" but like I'm sure it will work for a bunch of people.
I just reworked and added to my first chapter just today:

Any feedback would be appreciated.

This one was a close one for me, but I'm leaning on to would not keep reading, just on presentation alone.

It's odd. The first half is like a stage play, and I'm not sure why. It almost benefitted your writing style though since you really, really, really tell over show. In that format, it almost felt more intentional, like it was a stylistic choice. Plus all that was interesting if not a little dense.

But then once you get to the second half where it is formatted more standard as normal prose, it still has that stilted telling element.

And while it's not awful, it would really bug me reading on.

Outside of presentation, I don't mind what you're doing here and I found the beginning interesting. If the prose was a little more natural, I would keep reading.
 
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Underload

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@TheTrinary
Thanks for the quick feedback.
I guess I needed to be told about the formatting issue. It's something I picked up from published books. I don't know how to do it, and the result is the mess you saw. I'll make sure to keep an eye on it from now onwards. Thanks again.
 

nanchengnv

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So disconnected prologue is a pretty standard way of doing it. I eyed it over, seems fine.

Uh while it's not my kind of thing personally, from the prospective of someone who likes these stories, would keep reading.

There's not a whole bunch to say here. It's well written. Well executed. Just all around competent. I have to step back and say "not for me" but like I'm sure it will work for a bunch of people.
Thanks for the positive feedback.
 

Mysticant

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Hmm, as much as I am experimenting with something here, I am curious about what would be the first impression considering the complexity I am trying to aim for. You could probably choose either the prologue or chapter 1 since they are the pullers in my opinion. Very dialogue-heavy and subjective comedy just saying.
 
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TheTrinary

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I'd like you to please look at mine.

EXIT POINT
Would keep reading.

On principle, starting with a sit down tele conference between two people seems boring, but really this goes to prove anything can work in the right context. You have a continual focus on characters and the subject matter is interesting, especially since it sets up something in the near future. Really good prose. All around nice.

I had two hiccups with it. First, was the world building. It doesn't really make a lot of sense to me off the bat. We establish they are thieves but we also establish that it's like, a legitimate profession? And you can just talk in a café about it? It falls more into the "makes no sense" as opposed to "this is an interesting world." For the place it's published, it's perfectly fine though.

And then there's a fair bit of sci-fi googblty-gobblty. In a hard sci-fi I guess that's fine. When it's not, it's even more awkward.

Oh and then I just read the description? It's portal fantasy. If that's what it is, you really went above and beyond for the set up. It practically oozes style relatively speaking.
Hmm, as much as I am experimenting with something here, I am curious about what would be the first impression considering the complexity I am trying to aim for. You could probably choose either the prologue or chapter 1 since they are the pullers in my opinion. Very dialogue-heavy and subjective comedy just saying.
Would not keep reading.

So back to my old default: humor is subjective. And I didn't find it funny. Although you play it a lot more subtle than most comedies. I wouldn't have necessarily defaulted to that as the genre if you hadn't pointed it out.

Past that, there's not much more to comment on.
 
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FlyingPirateCat

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Can you to give me a feedback of my novel too?

https://www.scribblehub.com/series/120309/ appraiser.gif forestsmoke.gif
 
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TheTrinary

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Can you to give me a feedback of my novel too?
Would not keep reading.

On one hand, it's probably the first story I've seen that has production value, and that's pretty cool. On the other hand, I found the writing to be pretty grating. A few mistakes more than normal here or there, but what really got me was the style. You have a very "I want to tell" style, and I almost need to qualify that because it's different than when we normally say that.

Normally, an author would skip a description and just write: "There were two moons in the sky, so you know it isn't Earth." But you don't do that, you start by creating a perfectly adequate description and then you summarize it. Like, I don't need you to tell me this isn't Earth, I got the clue when there were two moons.

And there was a lot of that. Which almost makes me ask: who is the story for? Because it's certainly popular and not at all the kind of thing I see around here. And those sections make me think it's for a foreign audience. Why English I don't know, but to a native speaker it's almost insulting having these very straight forward recaps. But maybe to someone else it helps?

No ideas. Just some thoughts.

Past that, you lean into the gamelit in a pretty structured way and there's a lot of depth there. So I could also see how someone who is a big fan of this sort of thing finding enjoyment since they're getting a lot of what they want.
 
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