How to deal with this monster?

NotaNuffian

Still a fat dude, duh. But damn, that smile.
Joined
Nov 26, 2019
Messages
1,154
Points
153
What kind of fire is it resitant to, pretty sure a clorinetrifluride fire would do wonders at putting them down the heat from that alone would melt their arm cannon shiuld they sweat well the chemical would explode and well heat + vigorous oxygenated fires are pretty good at containing toxins, rapid heals dont really help agsinst something that can set fire to concrete
Fire resistance in D&D means halve the damage done by fire. Dumb man interpretation cuz laziness means that fire must burn twice as long or temperature by a multiplier no more than two hotter to cause the same damage over time as to non-resistant.

So clorinetrifluride fire can ignite sand and taking sand's boiling point to be 2300c (>4100f) and assuming trolls have normal human body of1800f for four hours...

I dunno how to keep constant heat and trolls have regen.
 

Jemini

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 27, 2019
Messages
1,097
Points
153
I mean a lot of healing factors make that plan useless. The knives would be pushed out. Well I dont know it's EXACT abilities and its limitations tho. Kt every healing factor is the same. For example, hydras are always said to be weak to fire cuz it prevents them from healing their heads. Even tho that's kinds bullshit

Can it really though? I've only ever seen portrayals of healing factors pushing out bullets, never (and I do mean NEVER) seen any portrayal of it doing the same with a knife.

If you think about it, it makes perfect sense. A bullet has a blunt shape, so there's stuff for the regenerating tissue to push on. However, that's only really for head and arm wounds. If it were a body wound, logically you might think the bullet would be pushed out of organs, but the skin would close before it could be pushed out of the body, causing the bullet to be caught inside the abdominal cavity.

In the case of knives though, they have a thin stream-lined construction, and the wider portion of the blade is, well... a blade. So, the healing flesh would just cut itself again by pushing on the blade. Thus, it would not be able to push the blade out. Someone with hands that are not arm-cannons would have to both notice the knife and also pull it out first before the healing could happen properly.

From a pure physics perspective, the flesh would close on the flat of the knife and create so much friction that it becomes impossible for the knife to be pushed out by it's own healing factor. The flesh on the flat of the blade just has too much surface tension so it will hold it there and continuously cut the flesh touching the sharp of the blade. In fact, if someone else came around and tried to pull the blade out, it would likely take several times the amount of strength that was used to push the knife in in the first place. The troll could probably do it if it had arms, but there's a chance that even if the wizard tries to help the troll that the wizard would simply lack the physical strength necessary to remove the offending object.

(This is actually more reason to make it knives. Knives are small enough that pulling them out would be really tough. Swords, on the other hand, would be longer and thus you could get more leverage and a better grip on it. Unless you burry the sword into the beast up to the hilt, it would be rather easy to dislodge by banging it against something. (On the other hand, if you actually DID manage to burry the sword up to the hilt, that thing ain't comin out. About the only way you are getting that thing back is if you kill the troll and then burn the body with fire in order to free up the sword from the flesh that is holding onto it.
 
Last edited:

Kilolo

Cute Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2019
Messages
245
Points
83
there's 2 way to beat it.

1. any artificial chimera (any biological being that not born through breeding) has seams on them. seams that connect every body parts.
no matter how good you create and reinforced the connection is, there's always a weakest link. since it's practically impossible to ties body parts yet making it identical with connected limbs through natural breed. the fact that the chimera had no pain receptor is actually a huge backlash for this kind of weakness. they wouldn't realize at all if their seems are being disconnected bit by bit.

2. just plug it. a canon type weapon is an output type weapon with hole in it. just fill the muzzle with cement or something that has earth subtance. since any attempt of burning it would only hardening it instead. a weapon without muzzle output is just a suicidal bomb. they would die by their own firepower.

also since the thing are so big and easily provoked. just lure it to outside the city using huge stack of meat or something, it might be invisible and silence. but something as big as that would definitely leave a footstep and trails. you need to be a huge idiot to lost track of them.
 
Joined
Feb 6, 2021
Messages
521
Points
63
dig out a hole. cover the sides with some sort of lubricant. lure the monster in, and once it falls light something up inside, and plug the whole shut. it'd suffocate soon enough. maybe even leave some food for it down. if it's stupid enough, it'd eat while smoke fills its lungs.
 

CupcakeNinja

He Who Fucks Your Mom
Joined
Jan 1, 2019
Messages
1,813
Points
153
Can it really though? I've only ever seen portrayals of healing factors pushing out bullets, never (and I do mean NEVER) seen any portrayal of it doing the same with a knife.

If you think about it, it makes perfect sense. A bullet has a blunt shape, so there's stuff for the regenerating tissue to push on. However, that's only really for head and arm wounds. If it were a body wound, logically you might think the bullet would be pushed out of organs, but the skin would close before it could be pushed out of the body, causing the bullet to be caught inside the abdominal cavity.

In the case of knives though, they have a thin stream-lined construction, and the wider portion of the blade is, well... a blade. So, the healing flesh would just cut itself again by pushing on the blade. Thus, it would not be able to push the blade out. Someone with hands that are not arm-cannons would have to both notice the knife and also pull it out first before the healing could happen properly.

From a pure physics perspective, the flesh would close on the flat of the knife and create so much friction that it becomes impossible for the knife to be pushed out by it's own healing factor. The flesh on the flat of the blade just has too much surface tension so it will hold it there and continuously cut the flesh touching the sharp of the blade. In fact, if someone else came around and tried to pull the blade out, it would likely take several times the amount of strength that was used to push the knife in in the first place. The troll could probably do it if it had arms, but there's a chance that even if the wizard tries to help the troll that the wizard would simply lack the physical strength necessary to remove the offending object.

(This is actually more reason to make it knives. Knives are small enough that pulling them out would be really tough. Swords, on the other hand, would be longer and thus you could get more leverage and a better grip on it. Unless you burry the sword into the beast up to the hilt, it would be rather easy to dislodge by banging it against something. (On the other hand, if you actually DID manage to burry the sword up to the hilt, that thing ain't comin out. About the only way you are getting that thing back is if you kill the troll and then burn the body with fire in order to free up the sword from the flesh that is holding onto it.
Wolverine in the comics has done that, so has deadpool. But that's cuz the knives stayed in them for a while without anyone holding them in constantly. Eventually their bodies forced them out to keep healing. Now, if they got impaled straight through I dont think that worked.

But you're right that it's probably rare. I'm probably thinking about monsters. I've seen several types of monsters and novels push out knives through the healing factor. Tho again, only cuz no one is KEEPING the blade inside them.

Yeah, logically it shouldnt happen. But you know comics.
 

Leyligne

Member
Joined
Sep 17, 2021
Messages
52
Points
18
Do they need to breathe? Wind mages always lack imagination in this regard.
Does magic resistance include teleportation? Lots of places you could move them to or part of them, or bring in troll-eating parasites. Or go Goblin Slayer and open a portal to the ocean floor.
There are ways, but most are macguffin like. More heroic would be like, “Get up! Move faster! Stop holding back!” Kind of stuff?
 

NotaNuffian

Still a fat dude, duh. But damn, that smile.
Joined
Nov 26, 2019
Messages
1,154
Points
153
Do they need to breathe? Wind mages always lack imagination in this regard.
Does magic resistance include teleportation? Lots of places you could move them to or part of them, or bring in troll-eating parasites. Or go Goblin Slayer and open a portal to the ocean floor.
There are ways, but most are macguffin like. More heroic would be like, “Get up! Move faster! Stop holding back!” Kind of stuff?
Yes they breathe. Trolls still need to breathe.

... magic resistance only affects damage done to them via magic... ie if you stab them with a +1 sword, +1 meaning the magic effect of the sword being sharper so the extra sharpeness is halved. So if you plan to do a telefrag of even a portal cut, it might work because a ton of damage is still half a ton of damage even after damage calculation. And yes you can move them to places, that is how the wizard shifted them from his lair to the city.
 

NotaNuffian

Still a fat dude, duh. But damn, that smile.
Joined
Nov 26, 2019
Messages
1,154
Points
153
Can it really though? I've only ever seen portrayals of healing factors pushing out bullets, never (and I do mean NEVER) seen any portrayal of it doing the same with a knife.

If you think about it, it makes perfect sense. A bullet has a blunt shape, so there's stuff for the regenerating tissue to push on. However, that's only really for head and arm wounds. If it were a body wound, logically you might think the bullet would be pushed out of organs, but the skin would close before it could be pushed out of the body, causing the bullet to be caught inside the abdominal cavity.

In the case of knives though, they have a thin stream-lined construction, and the wider portion of the blade is, well... a blade. So, the healing flesh would just cut itself again by pushing on the blade. Thus, it would not be able to push the blade out. Someone with hands that are not arm-cannons would have to both notice the knife and also pull it out first before the healing could happen properly.

From a pure physics perspective, the flesh would close on the flat of the knife and create so much friction that it becomes impossible for the knife to be pushed out by it's own healing factor. The flesh on the flat of the blade just has too much surface tension so it will hold it there and continuously cut the flesh touching the sharp of the blade. In fact, if someone else came around and tried to pull the blade out, it would likely take several times the amount of strength that was used to push the knife in in the first place. The troll could probably do it if it had arms, but there's a chance that even if the wizard tries to help the troll that the wizard would simply lack the physical strength necessary to remove the offending object.

(This is actually more reason to make it knives. Knives are small enough that pulling them out would be really tough. Swords, on the other hand, would be longer and thus you could get more leverage and a better grip on it. Unless you burry the sword into the beast up to the hilt, it would be rather easy to dislodge by banging it against something. (On the other hand, if you actually DID manage to burry the sword up to the hilt, that thing ain't comin out. About the only way you are getting that thing back is if you kill the troll and then burn the body with fire in order to free up the sword from the flesh that is holding onto it.
Wolverine in the comics has done that, so has deadpool. But that's cuz the knives stayed in them for a while without anyone holding them in constantly. Eventually their bodies forced them out to keep healing. Now, if they got impaled straight through I dont think that worked.

But you're right that it's probably rare. I'm probably thinking about monsters. I've seen several types of monsters and novels push out knives through the healing factor. Tho again, only cuz no one is KEEPING the blade inside them.

Yeah, logically it shouldnt happen. But you know comics.
I have seen phenomenons of such a thing in fictions too, but working as a part time ER assistant, that is not the case for regeneration for me.

If you don't remove the things stuck inside you, your body will just regrow the tissues around the foreign object still inside.

Oftentimes if the object is embedded deep enough, like passing the three layers of skin, that thing is here to stay. So whenever I see how super regen works by "reversing time" and heal the body, I thought that it is broken as well. Healing doesn't automatically fixes dislocated or misplaced bones, so how does it just push the foreign object, be it whole or fragmented bullets or knives out the body? Magic...

To hell, when Logan reforms his bones from nothing but his adamantium bones is broken AF. And the guy can still think throughout the process... how the hell that works is wtf.
 
Last edited:

Leyligne

Member
Joined
Sep 17, 2021
Messages
52
Points
18
Yes they breathe. Trolls still need to breathe.

And yes you can move them to places, that is how the wizard shifted them from his lair to the city.
Wind mage removes air around their heads, they drop like flies.
Move them to the ocean depths, they drown.
Drop them in freakin’ liquid hot magma for one... billion coins!
Killing them isn’t what’s hard, making the heroes heroic whilst doing so, that’s the rub. Something like, tracking the teleport back, raiding the wizard’s lair, pressing the recall runes to teleport the horde back to the evil base and then smashing the controls so they go amok in villain territory? Something heroic, that’s the ticket.
 

Jemini

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 27, 2019
Messages
1,097
Points
153
I have seen phenomenons of such a thing in fictions too, but working as a part time ER assistant, that is not the case for regeneration for me.

If you don't remove the things stuck inside you, your body will just regrow the tissues around the foreign object still inside.

Oftentimes if the object is embedded deep enough, like passing the three layers of skin, that thing is here to stay. So whenever I see how super regen works by "reversing time" and heal the body, I thought that it is broken as well. Healing doesn't automatically fixes dislocated or misplaced bones, so how does it just push the foreign object, be it whole or fragmented bullets or knives out the body? Magic...

To hell, when Logan reforms his bones from nothing but his adamantium bones is broken AF. And the guy can still think throughout the process... how the hell that works is wtf.

Well, I will take that as you accepting my serious answer.

You know what that means? That means now I can give the non-serious answer I've been holding onto and dying to share since I first saw this thread.

Non-serious answer: Get Lina Inverse to handle it.

Lina Inverse is a character from the "Slayers" anime. (The main character, as a matter of fact.) Slayers is a very D&D inspired anime from the 90s, and most of the monster and spell mechanics are the same.

Beings it was from the 1st and 2nd edition era though, this is still the period where mage players were highly encouraged to create their own custom spells. Well, Lina actually developed her own custom anti-troll spell. It's a touch-range spell that reverses healing factors. So, all she would have to do is cast this spell on the troll, and then have someone cause just the slightest nick on the thing. From there, it's own reversed healing factor would proceed to kill it.
 

Kilolo

Cute Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2019
Messages
245
Points
83
just saying, but i don't recommend giving the protagonist party a huge boost powerup or giving a special skill only for this one time occasion boss.

not only it would ruin the balance for the next plot to come, but it could also giving unpleasant feeling if you never use the new skillset for the future plot.

lots of popular manga/WN does this, but lost their fans because the story becoming inconsistent & they grumping out because author just forgot this skill they've used once and never again.
 

NotaNuffian

Still a fat dude, duh. But damn, that smile.
Joined
Nov 26, 2019
Messages
1,154
Points
153
Well, I will take that as you accepting my serious answer.

You know what that means? That means now I can give the non-serious answer I've been holding onto and dying to share since I first saw this thread.

Non-serious answer: Get Lina Inverse to handle it.

Lina Inverse is a character from the "Slayers" anime. (The main character, as a matter of fact.) Slayers is a very D&D inspired anime from the 90s, and most of the monster and spell mechanics are the same.

Beings it was from the 1st and 2nd edition era though, this is still the period where mage players were highly encouraged to create their own custom spells. Well, Lina actually developed her own custom anti-troll spell. It's a touch-range spell that reverses healing factors. So, all she would have to do is cast this spell on the troll, and then have someone cause just the slightest nick on the thing. From there, it's own reversed healing factor would proceed to kill it.
So letting the party's generic wizard mimic Lina's ability... it sounds useful and if it is just generic anti-healing/ healing reversal spell, it can be used for more situations than just this one particular troll problem.
just saying, but i don't recommend giving the protagonist party a huge boost powerup or giving a special skill only for this one time occasion boss.

not only it would ruin the balance for the next plot to come, but it could also giving unpleasant feeling if you never use the new skillset for the future plot.

lots of popular manga/WN does this, but lost their fans because the story becoming inconsistent & they grumping out because author just forgot this skill they've used once and never again.
So either too specific problem solvers or too OP balance breaker, kind of why Jojo author is cool because he uses his brain to allow creative use of abilities instead of Bleach's Ditto MC.
CONCEPTUAL DESTRUCTION, that's how immortals dies
Too OP. Way too OP.
 

Jemini

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 27, 2019
Messages
1,097
Points
153
So letting the party's generic wizard mimic Lina's ability... it sounds useful and if it is just generic anti-healing/ healing reversal spell, it can be used for more situations than just this one particular troll problem.

There is a reason why I said it was a non-serious answer. I mean, I guess you could use it if you wanted to. I think though, if you want to make this a serious fight and not have the problems other people have been bringing up, you'd best stick with the previously offered serious solution with the knives.

If you wanted to use Lina's anti-troll spell, you would need to have your party dealing with things before this fight to explain what prompted the wizard to make such a spell. It would just feel way too cheaty to have such a purpose-built spell to handle this one big-bad out of nowhere.

(In Slayers, it was already established that Lina had a huge area-of-effect spell that could have wiped out all the trolls just as easily... while causing a LOT of collateral damage... in the middle of a crowded town. It had also previously established that she has some custom purpose-built spells, such as this one that lets her easily catch fish with a strand of her own hair. So, it really followed that she might have a less destructive purpose-built solution to these trolls that she was suddenly put against. If you haven't done anything like that in your own story, I'd actually recommend against this solution.)
 

NotaNuffian

Still a fat dude, duh. But damn, that smile.
Joined
Nov 26, 2019
Messages
1,154
Points
153
Also, somehow my MC grew a heart from all the regicides he commited, plus the fact that he wants to bone the queen and princess in the city, that's why he wants to prevent the catastrophe.

The MC can't bone ashes, snort it in might be an option though.

Ps. Tried to quote myself. Failed.
 

ElijahRyne

Not that Lazy…
Joined
Aug 12, 2021
Messages
405
Points
43
Also, somehow my MC grew a heart from all the regicides he commited, plus the fact that he wants to bone the queen and princess in the city, that's why he wants to prevent the catastrophe.

The MC can't bone ashes, snort it in might be an option though.

Ps. Tried to quote myself. Failed.
Then get some cesium and irradiate the chimeras!
 
Top