Kindle Unlimited Exclusivity: Reader opinions on it

As a reader, what do you think of the kindle unlimited exclusivity rules?

  • I love it

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • I like it

    Votes: 1 12.5%
  • I'm indifferent

    Votes: 2 25.0%
  • I dont like it

    Votes: 3 37.5%
  • I hate it

    Votes: 2 25.0%

  • Total voters
    8

Sabruness

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Title says it all. Discuss your views on the exclusivity rules and conditions required when authors publish with amazon kindle unlimited.

Personally, i can understand if the author wants to make as much money as possible but i think it's a risk. As a reader, i'm not a fan of it as it makes re-reading practically impossible due to all content vanishing. It also hinders a story from enticing potential future readers as well.

So, dear scribblians, what are your thoughts? the thread is open
 

yansusustories

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Not sure if my opinion counts here since I'm also an author but as a reader, if I like a story enough to reread it, then I would buy the book. Then I can read it as often as I want.
 

Sabruness

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Not sure if my opinion counts here since I'm also an author but as a reader, if I like a story enough to reread it, then I would buy the book. Then I can read it as often as I want.
all opinions are welcome.
That's a fair point. But what if a novel is good enough to re-read as a freely posted web novel but not good enough to buy as a published book?
 

CupcakeNinja

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*Another one of Cupcake's famous rants*

I never messed around with that. What do you mean by vanish? Tho anything that limits your work from spreading is bad m'kay. Author who write with money in mind however....well they should probably not write in Asian light novel format at least. All the stuff having to do with the Japanese anime and Chinese cultivation culture isn't something a western company would likely work with you on i would say. I would find it highly doubtful you would get it legit published in hardcover like serious authors would. Wouldn't mesh well, the Asian style and concepts I see everyone here using. Apart from Amazon and patreon sort of deals I don't know how you would get paid for your work or be published in a manner similar to, I dunno, Harry Potter.

To reach your target demographic, people who know and enjoy the culture and concepts you'd talk about,; you'd have to publish from some Asian company right?

It's either free online to possibly gain a large following or you publish through Amazon-like websites and get paid a piss poor amount with little potential for viewer growth. I assume Asian owmed publishers such as Kadokawa Shoten wouldn't work with foreign authors as I say this. Apart from Qi who I hear will own your novel as soon as you make a contract. I dunno if they would sell physical copies either.

I feel I deviated from the topic. But it does tie back in sorta. In way of saying how limited the options are and what you should--or shouldn't--do if authors of our variety want money for what we write.

Like for example could you imagine MY story being published through a western company that pays well? ...no okay mine might barely pass since it's sorta just a western medieval ish fantasy world setting if you leave out the whole otome game stuff....but it's surviving off memes and clearly the characters belong in an anime, not like some game of thrones episode or whatever. They'd appear fucking bonkers to the uncultured eye! And what western--fuck it let's say northern and southern too-- publisher would print that kinda shit?

Or a story like that Ero Dungeon? Just wouldn't happen.


*End of rant*

*Breaths*
 
Last edited:

yansusustories

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all opinions are welcome.
That's a fair point. But what if a novel is good enough to re-read as a freely posted web novel but not good enough to buy as a published book?
Honestly, I can't think of even one novel that would fall into that category. A story is either good enough to reread or not. The way it's published doesn't have to do anything with that for me. And considering that the prizes for self-published novels on Amazon are mostly below that for a coffee at Starbucks, I don't think I'd have a problem to buy it even if it wasn't a favorite of mine.
And if I think it's not worth the money, then I won't reread. As simple as that.
 

Ace_Arriande

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Author who write with money in mind however....well they should probably not write in Asian light novel format at least. All the stuff having to do with the Japanese anime and Chinese cultivation culture isn't something a western company would likely work with you on i would say.
There are numerous weeb authors making full-time livings through Amazon and Kindle Unlimited in particular. Honestly, with self-publishing and how utterly massive Amazon is, it doesn't matter if you write in a light novel format and use Japanese/Chinese themes or not. Sure, the chances are low, but you probably have better chances making money through something like KU by putting an Eastern spin on your writing. It's pretty niche as far as self-published works go and there are most definitely people willing to pay for it.

Or you could just write in a typical Western format like what 99% of English novels are in and compete with everybody else trying to appeal to general interest instead of honing in on a specific audience. Then you can play the game of trying to get a traditional publisher by sending your manuscript to hundreds of them, sometimes over the course of decades, only to get declined again, and again, and again, and again, when you probably could have just self-published some weebshit and made money that entire time while not forcing yourself to conform for a potential shot at a traditional publisher = P.

Genre also matters. LitRPG, GameLit, and even Wuxia are all huge right now in terms of websites like Royal Road, Webnovel, and Scribble Hub, and they're successful on Amazon. Those genres pretty often borrow Eastern themes (Wuxia in particular, obviously) and are even written in a light novel format sometimes.

Are they traditionally published by some fancy publishing house that pays for all the marketing, expenses, etc? Nah. Are some of those authors still making more than six figures yearly with ease? Absolutely. So, it doesn't really matter whether or not a Western company would want to work with you when self-publishing is more than good enough unless you're trying to become some worldwide-famous mega-hit like Harry Potter.

But seriously, don't underestimate how many weebs and Japanese/Chinese fans in general there are. Not only is an Asian company unlikely to ever work with you unless they plan on taking advantage of you (Webnovel) or if you know their language and can write in it, but there are plenty of weeaboos and chinaboos happy to spend money on original, self-published English works that borrow themes and tropes from their favorite Chinese cartoons.

All that really matters is that you're writing what people want to read. If you're not writing what people want to read, you're going to get paid a "piss poor amount with little potential for viewer growth" regardless of whether you're writing in a Western or Eastern style. Style and even quality are significantly less important than being able to write something that is fun, that catches attention, and that people want to read. I've seen several authors from Royal Road who only had 600-1k followers with meh-rated stories who made anywhere from $2k to $6k in the first month of self-publishing with KU. If you're able to write a story that gets at least 1k followers, you're probably decent enough to make enough money via Amazon's self-publishing even if you're a weeb. You just have to learn how to properly make use of Amazon's tools for self-publishing, and that's a non-issue when there are tons of free guides online.

tl;dr: Getting traditionally published is a meme that tons of serious authors don't even care about anymore since it's just unnecessary. You can easily make money by writing in an "Asian light novel format" if you still know how to write a story that people want to read.

Or a story like that Ero Dungeon? Just wouldn't happen.
truth tho lmao

Now, to answer the original OP since I'm here...

Personally, i can understand if the author wants to make as much money as possible but i think it's a risk. As a reader, i'm not a fan of it as it makes re-reading practically impossible due to all content vanishing. It also hinders a story from enticing potential future readers as well.
After a certain point, you're going to get more readers from self-publishing with something like KU than you would by staying free forever on the internet. My longest story over on RR is sitting at 2090 followers right now and probably only gained 500 over the last year (compared to 1500 in the first month). Once the initial exposure bump is over, the exposure you can get from self-publishing is far higher than what you can get by hoping some random new reader stumbles upon your story on the same site that it's always been on. It does suck for the readers who want to re-read it for free, but I would never fault an author for doing it. Reading for free is a privilege.


yay for making long seriousposts to procrastinate
 

UnknownSaint171

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I can’t help but agree with the perspectives here. I’ve seen people who aren’t experts in writing make crummy stories but still got sold and got a 200$ check after a year on Amazon. It’s not a lot but it’s good pocket change for writing a story that didn’t take strenuous effort. So what if a good novel actually sold there? But then again I’ve seen many great novels buried in Amazon too...

I think it matters is how you execute and approach yours followers when advertising your story

But yeah I agree with Yansu@ as well. In the end it’s just 2.99-9.99 for a good book. It’s pretty cheap for a good way to kill time. Don’t underestimate book-lovers lol. Buy and binge read all day.

As a paperback lover I hate to admit but online publishing is winning.

@Ace_Arriande is right, ugh I’ve seen people on RoyalRoad make like 2K monthly with Patreon and it’s only a part time job! That’s really envious lol. But yeah thank you for reminding the crucially part “learning how to use the tools” looks like I need to do more research and observe how others do it as well huh?
But can someday one even make a living or something close to WebNovel authors in China i can’t help but wonder?
 

CupcakeNinja

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There are numerous weeb authors making full-time livings through Amazon and Kindle Unlimited in particular. Honestly, with self-publishing and how utterly massive Amazon is, it doesn't matter if you write in a light novel format and use Japanese/Chinese themes or not. Sure, the chances are low, but you probably have better chances making money through something like KU by putting an Eastern spin on your writing. It's pretty niche as far as self-published works go and there are most definitely people willing to pay for it.

Or you could just write in a typical Western format like what 99% of English novels are in and compete with everybody else trying to appeal to general interest instead of honing in on a specific audience. Then you can play the game of trying to get a traditional publisher by sending your manuscript to hundreds of them, sometimes over the course of decades, only to get declined again, and again, and again, and again, when you probably could have just self-published some weebshit and made money that entire time while not forcing yourself to conform for a potential shot at a traditional publisher = P.

Genre also matters. LitRPG, GameLit, and even Wuxia are all huge right now in terms of websites like Royal Road, Webnovel, and Scribble Hub, and they're successful on Amazon. Those genres pretty often borrow Eastern themes (Wuxia in particular, obviously) and are even written in a light novel format sometimes.

Are they traditionally published by some fancy publishing house that pays for all the marketing, expenses, etc? Nah. Are some of those authors still making more than six figures yearly with ease? Absolutely. So, it doesn't really matter whether or not a Western company would want to work with you when self-publishing is more than good enough unless you're trying to become some worldwide-famous mega-hit like Harry Potter.

But seriously, don't underestimate how many weebs and Japanese/Chinese fans in general there are. Not only is an Asian company unlikely to ever work with you unless they plan on taking advantage of you (Webnovel) or if you know their language and can write in it, but there are plenty of weeaboos and chinaboos happy to spend money on original, self-published English works that borrow themes and tropes from their favorite Chinese cartoons.

All that really matters is that you're writing what people want to read. If you're not writing what people want to read, you're going to get paid a "piss poor amount with little potential for viewer growth" regardless of whether you're writing in a Western or Eastern style. Style and even quality are significantly less important than being able to write something that is fun, that catches attention, and that people want to read. I've seen several authors from Royal Road who only had 600-1k followers with meh-rated stories who made anywhere from $2k to $6k in the first month of self-publishing with KU. If you're able to write a story that gets at least 1k followers, you're probably decent enough to make enough money via Amazon's self-publishing even if you're a weeb. You just have to learn how to properly make use of Amazon's tools for self-publishing, and that's a non-issue when there are tons of free guides online.

tl;dr: Getting traditionally published is a meme that tons of serious authors don't even care about anymore since it's just unnecessary. You can easily make money by writing in an "Asian light novel format" if you still know how to write a story that people want to read.


truth tho lmao

Now, to answer the original OP since I'm here...


After a certain point, you're going to get more readers from self-publishing with something like KU than you would by staying free forever on the internet. My longest story over on RR is sitting at 2090 followers right now and probably only gained 500 over the last year (compared to 1500 in the first month). Once the initial exposure bump is over, the exposure you can get from self-publishing is far higher than what you can get by hoping some random new reader stumbles upon your story on the same site that it's always been on. It does suck for the readers who want to re-read it for free, but I would never fault an author for doing it. Reading for free is a privilege.


yay for making long seriousposts to procrastinate
I guess I didn't realize how large Amazon and kindle had become then.

They're niche genres but I suppose the number of weebs worldwide is still substantial. To be honest even I don't usually read physical copies of books these days either. Online novels are the future I guess.

What about you? You got any novels on things like Amazon ? I noticed you had like at least two or three stories here yeah? Dunno how you do it man. Me, I'm a chronic procrastinator. Hell I have to placate my readers with short stories just to buy myself more time and STILL wait till like the last few hours to get shit done.

Teach me Sensei. Teach me your ways. I-I can make you feel good...
 
D

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First I'll give my broad opinions as an author, but I'll post it under a spoiler, then I'll give my opinions as a reader:

The idea that authors will lose potential future readers is a moot point if you're looking to monetise your writing. Those potential readers would only be potential readers of free content. Yeah, posting your novel for free might gain you saaaay, 10,000 readers. But if none of those readers are paying you, then the amount of exposure is purely for ego and joy of sharing. If you post your book exclusively on kindle for, say, $5, depending on which royalty payout you choose you will either get $1.75 or $3.50 for any book sold (before tax) - for the sake of cohesion let's pick one, and to be grimly realistic, let's pick 35% royalties. You might have 10,000 free readers, but the amount of money you're getting off those readers is $0 (I stress "free readers" and not "patreons" or "ko-fi supporters" or anything like that, since that's a different conversation). Even if you lose 90% of those 10,000 readers, leaving only 1,000 of those readers willing to buy your book - your payout is $1,750 (again, before tax). So. You have less readers, yes, but you also have $1,750 more than the $0 you had before.

The point: authors looking to monetise their work through paid exclusivity aren't really risking the loss of "potential" readers because the caveat to that is that those potential readers aren't going be paying the author, so their loss or gain within the context of paid publishing is not relevant.
As a reader you might not like it because it makes "re-reading practically impossible". Well, that just means that you clearly aren't a reader willing to pay the author for the work you enjoy enough to want to reread in the first place, in which case... not to be a huge bitch or anything, but to an author looking to monetise their work, your sorrow at being unable to parasitically access their product for free doesn't matter.

The flipside to this is: if you are an author looking to monetise your work, expect that only 5-10% of your audience are willing to become your paying audience. I'm not presenting this number as an absolute - you may get much, much more. You may have a very supportive fanbase. Maybe the reverse of 90% will even be willing to move up to becoming a paying audience. Be ready for a better turnout, but always assume the lowest of expectations to start, and to that end, probably don't consider exclusive paid publishing unless the assumed 5-10% of your readership would present a figure worth going exclusive for.

Okay, now as a reader: as yansusustories said, if a work is good enough that I'd want to reread it, it is work I am willing to pay for. Considering self-published kindle books tend to be very cheap, especially because they like to aggressively price match and do a lot of sales, it's not like you're sacrificing a chunk of your wallet to buy the book. I looked up a certain popular self-published LitRPG series just now, and the most expensive book in the series was sub USD$10 (roughly $8). So if I'm unwilling to pay $1-$10 dollars for something, it's probably not something I'd have ever reread in the first place anyway. In fact, if I liked a story enough that I'd want to reread it, and heard it was being removed from SH/RRL because it was being posted on kindle, I'd probably be very excited for that author and want to support them by buying the book, and would be happy to have the convenience of having the story on kindle so I could read on the go. My mobile plan is the cheapest I can get from my provider, so I don't have a lot of data to spare, so when I bought my favourite book series on kindle recently and was able to download it and read it at the bus stop or while having lunch while out in town, I was very happy. I'm drinking the kindle kool-aid.

Yes, there are stories on this site I'm more or less only reading because I have free access to them, and if they were to end up behind a paywall, my passion for them wouldn't be so deep I'd bother to buy them. But those aren't stories I would desperately want to reread and re-experience all over again either. If you're rereading a story, but it's not a story you'd be willing to pay a single digit number for, then maybe you need to examine if it's a story you're reading because you actually like it, or if you're reading it because it is free and you have nothing better to do with your time. I know when I'm reading a story because, eh, it's free, and that also gives me the freedom to drop the story if I find I'm actually not that into it, because I have invested nothing more than free time I would have wasted some other way into it.

I didn't mean for this to turn into a lecture. But you asked "what if a novel is good enough to re-read as a freely posted web novel but not good enough to buy as a published book?" and my answer to that is "it's probably not actually good enough to reread as a freely posted webnovel at all, you're just bored and desperate for something to do".
 

Ace_Arriande

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I guess I didn't realize how large Amazon and kindle had become then.

They're niche genres but I suppose the number of weebs worldwide is still substantial. To be honest even I don't usually read physical copies of books these days either. Online novels are the future I guess.

What about you? You got any novels on things like Amazon ? I noticed you had like at least two or three stories here yeah? Dunno how you do it man. Me, I'm a chronic procrastinator. Hell I have to placate my readers with short stories just to buy myself more time and STILL wait till like the last few hours to get shit done.

Teach me Sensei. Teach me your ways. I-I can make you feel good...
Amazon's Kindle service and Kindle Unlimited are massive. It's the biggest distributor of books afaik, or at least of ebooks. It's estimated there are at least 3 million active subscribers of Kindle Unlimited alone. Then there are way, way more who use Amazon for all their ebook needs without being subscribers of KU. They're big enough that they have a monopoly and you have to either really stick true to your morals or just hate money to not use Amazon (and KDP). You can also self-publish physical copies via Amazon. Then there's Audible which is connected to Amazon.

And I don't have any on it yet. I plan on publishing two books there later this year after I get some illustrations for one of them and do editing for them. I treat web novels as very rough drafts with next to no editing nor proofreading, so a lot of work needs done before I can confidently self-publish. I just talk to a lot of people who already have published there and have been researching the ways to go about it = P. And I've actually got 5 ongoing weekly stories (5k word chapters for 3 of them, 3k word chapters for 2 of them), but two of them aren't up on SH yet > : ^ ). As for how, this is literally my job (I make enough via Patreon to live off of), so I write for 40-60 hours per week most weeks. But yeah, I also procrastinate a ton which is why I always end up writing on the weekends which is when I'm supposed to be taking the days "off."

There is no cure to procrastination.
 

lnv

✪ Well-Known Hypocrite
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Title says it all. Discuss your views on the exclusivity rules and conditions required when authors publish with amazon kindle unlimited.

Personally, i can understand if the author wants to make as much money as possible but i think it's a risk. As a reader, i'm not a fan of it as it makes re-reading practically impossible due to all content vanishing. It also hinders a story from enticing potential future readers as well.

So, dear scribblians, what are your thoughts? the thread is open

That depends on how you look at it... I mean you can see the KDP as promotional thing where you promote the book for readers. And if they like it so much they want to reread it, they can buy it. Simple as that.

Looking online, KDP pays about $0.00488 per page, and its 187 words per page? A typical light novel volume is ~50,000 words(rounds to 270 pages). So that comes down to $1.3176. In comparison a light novel goes for what $5-$10 per volume?

It doesn't sound unreasonable to either the author nor the reader.

Looking at it another way, if I rent an HD movie on amazon for 30 days, it costs $4, if I buy $18.(22% to rent of buy cost)

$1.3176 ends up 13%-26% of buy cost.

I mean it isn't like I don't understand from a reader standpoint of wanting constant unlimited access to the content, but at same time, it isn't any different than any other content. It's not really a moral dilemma.
 
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