Long living elves would be kinda weird

TotallyHuman

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I was watching a dnd podcast, and there was a green text story about an elven girl who wanted to resurrect her lover, and she went to extreme lengths to do the smallest things, just because she had all the time in the world and it was her equivalent of us trying to reach the remote by crawling over the couch and barely nudging it with our fingers instead of standing up and getting it.
So, I decided that whatever elves (and other long-living species) I have written before, were written wrong now. I think of rewriting them.
Here's my revised general elf (insert long-living species) behavior guide:
Elves are very solidary, though it all is relative. They can be in the company of other creatures for many many years and decades and be (from a human perspective) the most loyal and loving and nicest people ever or the pettiest, nastiest, eviliest enemies you could imagine, but from their perspective, it's the same as attentively killing time by playing with cats or smth.
Especially when it comes to their interactions with humans. Due to how quickly humans get born and die, to them, humans are what a butterfly is to a human. Imagine being raised for 20 years by your adoptive elven mother, who is the bestest mother you could ever imagine and you love her to death, only for her to suddenly disappear one day after she went out to buy milk. You go to search for her and think that she was kidnapped/killed and make it your life goal to find her/avenge her. After grueling 20 years of searching and investigating, you find her and she doesn't remember you. All because she, in human terms, went out to play at her friend's house, found a butterfly on the way, played with it for 20 minutes, got distracted, lost sight of butterfly and then went on her way again, forgetting how the butterfly even looked.
Or imagine your acquaintance had an elven partner, and they had a very happy marriage and had, like two or three kids, and then the acquaintance died, and the elf left immediately, didn't even show a hint of emotion, didn't care about the kids. You meet them several years later, they don't even remember the acquaintance or the kids, not the names, not the faces, not where they lived. Again, playing with a butterfly.
In fact, elves don't have a strong sense of kinship or loyalty. They are a functional race, however, because they don't see a single problem devoting centuries of their time raising their young, just because it's nothing for them.
Needless to say, they are walking libraries of information, know more crafts and have more skills than entire human cities (countries maybe even combined) because they can devote human lifetimes worth of knowledge in obsessively and singlemindedly pursuing mastery in whatever they want, because for them it's like us picking up a hobby and trying it for a week and then dropping it if we don't like it anymore. Though they don't have a civilization of their own and generally dress like beggars and live in the woods without even a roof over their heads.
Elves aren't beautiful. Most are emaciated walking skeletons with dried out skin tightly wrapped around, because eating and drinking every day, or even every month is too frequent for them. They mostly persist on magical regeneration.
Elves are generally disastrously bad at tasks that require strong focus on short-term tasks such as holding a conversation with a human(or lifespan equivalent races), or planning a meeting, or having a fistfight.
A conversation with an elf would be very difficult for a human (unless they are paying a lot of attention in their butterfly observation mode), since their conversation partner would either not talk for very very long and you don't even know if they listen, or they talk for far too long, going into depths that could be written into books.
When elves agree to meet, it's possible for them to come decades apart to different the same place and still meet, because the first elf will wait those decades.
No human(lifespan equivalent race) wants to have them at their service. Who needs an advisor who could draft up a plan that would ensure a thousand years of prosperity but appears only once every 3 generations of Kings and Queens and not even remember the Kings and Queens in question?
In fact, if you have an elf in your adventurer party, they need constant supervision by some babysitter-role, because an elf is just too unadjusted to the high pace of human life.
Measuring elven intelligence or wisdom in human terms is... unfruitful. They are unreasonably stupid from some points of view, unreasonably smart in others. They are just too different.
But nobody wants to mess with elves. They are stupid hard to kill, their magical regeneration good enough to fuel their lifespans to many thousands of years, making them basically slightly nerfed fantasy Deadpools, and the single-minded devotion to a task they can show can be very very frightening when it is directed to malice. Even a country will fall when a mildly inconvenienced mf who's older than your civilization tries to destroy it in more and more imaginative and creative ways. Though, again, their ideas of malice and benevolence are much different than ours. They are pretty unemotional if you look at them from a scale befitting their lifespans, but on a human timescale... they can be literal angels or demons.
And, of course, they can go on epic quests for the smallest of things. An elf heard that on the other side of the world, some beautiful flower had bloomed. They will walk on their feet across continents. Swim on primitive drafts or even with their bodies alone across oceans and by the time they'll go to where the flowers once bloomed, the entire flower species will go extinct. And they'll feel that it was a shame and eh, whatever.
They will grow an apple tree instead of buying an apple.
They don't have a civilization of their own. They don't value kinship and an effective government consisting of elves would just not work, since that's too fast paced. If a kingdom of elves did exist, it would have a giant territory, a super small population, and every question concerning laws would have probably involve every elf in the country and have drawn out and long debates. They would build some ridiculous superpower though. With most people being homeless because they can't be bothered to build a house or some have built a house but haven't visited it in long enough that it's probably been swallowed by the earth by now.
If an elf battles, they will either force you into a very drawn out war that will slowly chip away at you until you are dust, or they will nuke you with a super-powerful spell, or they will go away for years and literally discover radiation on their own, then design and build a nuke to nuke you.
A friendly banterish fight between two elves goes down in legends of short-living beings. In fact, individual elves are often worshipped as Gods in even mighty large cultures (most those elves were very motivated butterfly botanists. Like raging bonkers for butterflies), though elves themselves don't really experience the same existential difficulties as humans and don't really get the concept of god or religion.
 

ArcadiaBlade

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*Writing an Elf MC since I want to try Isekai for a new novel*

*Sees this thread*

..........


*Begins Revising Half of the storyboard*
 

Amok

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Yeah, fleshed-out race and a more, let's say realistic take on immortality/longevity(lich-like in appearance, which makes sense.) In terms of memory though, I'm sure some elves do recall their children(if they can retain all kinda skills and lore), while others just see it as non-important to their existence(butterfly, as you say).

I'm not much for the traditional shtick in my own writing(elves, dwarves, dragons, anthropomorphic gods. etc) but I would like to see more tales with these sort of elves in them, almost like the elves(go by other names as well) in the Vlad Taltos series by Steven Burst: Colder, harsher, with individuals used to taking the long view due to being practically immortal/reincarnatable(with rare exceptions concerning deaths via certain blades).
 

Mr.Grey-Cat

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You have probably lost track at some point it seems. Because what you are describing is contradicting each other.

Honesty to me, what you spoke about seem like a demon that just one day woke up into existence, more than a species.

And if elves are as emotionless as you described then why care for a human? Why act like a mother? It's just weird. Instead, she would just kidnap it, put a leash on it neck, and start taming it without even bothering to converse (just like a human would deal with an insect).

And again, you said they don't need kinship or companions? Then, those are no species, but simply a type of very similar unique mutations or something, because from what you described they are clearly not ones to care for stuff like giving birth, survival, or genes. As such each one will probably be a unique individual with a pure blood, and no sex drive nor any desire for descendants except for intellectual curiosity, maybe?
 

Anon_Y_Mousse

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Geez, these elves must have million year lifespans to not even treat humans as dogs at the very least.

Now, something even more entertaining would be seeing what they would do at the END of their lifespan.(like that one idea I had of a dragon reaching the end of their 100 million year lifespan and finally interacting with humans as an equal due to some form of insanity)
 

Layenlml

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There is one problem here... how do the know that they are long lived without a civilization? They should live like a normal human in terms of how they perceive the world and then change as they age and started noticing those around dying.

The description fits a thousands/million years old elve rather than a 'normal' one and again, they are weak, truly weak as an especie if they dont reproduce or care about that stuff since they are not inmortal and can be killed as soon as they appear by the short lived races as countermesure... too many flaws but it would fit the lone and unique hermit that appears in the story.
 

TotallyHuman

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You have probably lost track at some point it seems. Because what you are describing is contradicting each other.

Honesty to me, what you spoke about seem like a demon that just one day woke up into existence, more than a species.

And if elves are as emotionless as you described then why care for a human? Why act like a mother? It's just weird. Instead, she would just kidnap it, put a leash on it neck, and start taming it without even bothering to converse (just like a human would deal with an insect).

And again, you said they don't need kinship or companions? Then, those are no species, but simply a type of very similar unique mutations or something, because from what you described they are clearly not ones to care for stuff like giving birth, survival, or genes. As such each one will probably be a unique individual with a pure blood, and no sex drive nor any desire for descendants except for intellectual curiosity, maybe?
Well, that's just me throwing ideas around. I do think it could use some work. Though, in other areas than those you pointed out.
They aren't emotionless, the range of emotions available to them, and the depth is like the entire electromagnetic spectrum vs the visible light spectrum available to humans. They experience the visible light, but the entire visible light spectrum is too small compared to the entire electromagnetic spectrum. That's why I called them unemotional, since an elven grief or joy is rare, and of a depth impossible for us to fathom
For example, while I compare humans to butterflies, and elves to humans, it's a very vague comparison that isn't to be taken too literally. It's like, for an Elf 60-70 years is basically what 60-70 minutes is to us. But, it doesn't mean that they can't perceive individual seconds, that are actual seconds. They wouldn't be able to walk, eat, read, write, learn otherwise. They can, and caring for a human in any way, which is basically them holding things in great focus for 60 (of their) minutes, is the same as basically putting their single-mindedness to good use, but on a single individual. We can't converse with butterflies, but elves can converse with humans, they can read our books. They largely don't care about us though.
As for them not being a species because they don't need kinship and companions? Well, evolution doesn't have a checklist for things that can or can't live. As long as it survives and leaves its genes, it's fine. Elves don't have sexual drive, but every now and then they can have a child and they do have children. They just don't put the same levels of importance on family as us.
do the know that they are long lived without a civilization?
They don't have countries and folklore, but they can meet together. Its not that they avoid contact, they are just highly individual.
they are weak, truly weak as an especie if they dont reproduce or care about that stuff since they are not inmortal and can be killed as soon as they appear by the short lived races
I did write the settings of them having stupid regeneration like Deadpool, and if they get angry, they are very dangerous, since it's like a single country working together towards a single goal for many decades in terms of intelligence and with the mobility of a single individual. Even when they are very young,they are dangerous.
What can a species do against them? Send an army and the elf will escape. Catch them and throw them in prison? They'll escape. Eventually. They can wait very long for a perfect opportunity and can plan very well. And then the elf will get angry.
A short-lived species will be caught up in its own problems while the elf will obsessively scheme for many years without rest to get rid of the species and will grow exponentially more effective with time. Sow discord? Assassinate? Poison? Create weapons of mass-destruction? Bribe? Brainwash? Nothing is impossible as long as the elf puts their mind to it. The scale they think at is just too large
 
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Zirrboy

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I am disappointed you used three characters. A simple "k" would have sufficed.

I was watching a dnd podcast, and there was a green text story about an elven girl who wanted to resurrect her lover, and she went to extreme lengths to do the smallest things, just because she had all the time in the world and it was her equivalent of us trying to reach the remote by crawling over the couch and barely nudging it with our fingers instead of standing up and getting it.
So, I decided that whatever elves (and other long-living species) I have written before, were written wrong now. I think of rewriting them.
Here's my revised general elf (insert long-living species) behavior guide:
Elves are very solidary, though it all is relative. They can be in the company of other creatures for many many years and decades and be (from a human perspective) the most loyal and loving and nicest people ever or the pettiest, nastiest, eviliest enemies you could imagine, but from their perspective, it's the same as attentively killing time by playing with cats or smth.
Especially when it comes to their interactions with humans. Due to how quickly humans get born and die, to them, humans are what a butterfly is to a human. Imagine being raised for 20 years by your adoptive elven mother, who is the bestest mother you could ever imagine and you love her to death, only for her to suddenly disappear one day after she went out to buy milk. You go to search for her and think that she was kidnapped/killed and make it your life goal to find her/avenge her. After grueling 20 years of searching and investigating, you find her and she doesn't remember you. All because she, in human terms, went out to play at her friend's house, found a butterfly on the way, played with it for 20 minutes, got distracted, lost sight of butterfly and then went on her way again, forgetting how the butterfly even looked.
Or imagine your acquaintance had an elven partner, and they had a very happy marriage and had, like two or three kids, and then the acquaintance died, and the elf left immediately, didn't even show a hint of emotion, didn't care about the kids. You meet them several years later, they don't even remember the acquaintance or the kids, not the names, not the faces, not where they lived. Again, playing with a butterfly.
In fact, elves don't have a strong sense of kinship or loyalty. They are a functional race, however, because they don't see a single problem devoting centuries of their time raising their young, just because it's nothing for them.
Needless to say, they are walking libraries of information, know more crafts and have more skills than entire human cities (countries maybe even combined) because they can devote human lifetimes worth of knowledge in obsessively and singlemindedly pursuing mastery in whatever they want, because for them it's like us picking up a hobby and trying it for a week and then dropping it if we don't like it anymore. Though they don't have a civilization of their own and generally dress like beggars and live in the woods without even a roof over their heads.
Elves aren't beautiful. Most are emaciated walking skeletons with dried out skin tightly wrapped around, because eating and drinking every day, or even every month is too frequent for them. They mostly persist on magical regeneration.
Elves are generally disastrously bad at tasks that require strong focus on short-term tasks such as holding a conversation with a human(or lifespan equivalent races), or planning a meeting, or having a fistfight.
A conversation with an elf would be very difficult for a human (unless they are paying a lot of attention in their butterfly observation mode), since their conversation partner would either not talk for very very long and you don't even know if they listen, or they talk for far too long, going into depths that could be written into books.
When elves agree to meet, it's possible for them to come decades apart to different the same place and still meet, because the first elf will wait those decades.
No human(lifespan equivalent race) wants to have them at their service. Who needs an advisor who could draft up a plan that would ensure a thousand years of prosperity but appears only once every 3 generations of Kings and Queens and not even remember the Kings and Queens in question?
In fact, if you have an elf in your adventurer party, they need constant supervision by some babysitter-role, because an elf is just too unadjusted to the high pace of human life.
Measuring elven intelligence or wisdom in human terms is... unfruitful. They are unreasonably stupid from some points of view, unreasonably smart in others. They are just too different.
But nobody wants to mess with elves. They are stupid hard to kill, their magical regeneration good enough to fuel their lifespans to many thousands of years, making them basically slightly nerfed fantasy Deadpools, and the single-minded devotion to a task they can show can be very very frightening when it is directed to malice. Even a country will fall when a mildly inconvenienced mf who's older than your civilization tries to destroy it in more and more imaginative and creative ways. Though, again, their ideas of malice and benevolence are much different than ours. They are pretty unemotional if you look at them from a scale befitting their lifespans, but on a human timescale... they can be literal angels or demons.
And, of course, they can go on epic quests for the smallest of things. An elf heard that on the other side of the world, some beautiful flower had bloomed. They will walk on their feet across continents. Swim on primitive drafts or even with their bodies alone across oceans and by the time they'll go to where the flowers once bloomed, the entire flower species will go extinct. And they'll feel that it was a shame and eh, whatever.
They will grow an apple tree instead of buying an apple.
They don't have a civilization of their own. They don't value kinship and an effective government consisting of elves would just not work, since that's too fast paced. If a kingdom of elves did exist, it would have a giant territory, a super small population, and every question concerning laws would have probably involve every elf in the country and have drawn out and long debates. They would build some ridiculous superpower though. With most people being homeless because they can't be bothered to build a house or some have built a house but haven't visited it in long enough that it's probably been swallowed by the earth by now.
If an elf battles, they will either force you into a very drawn out war that will slowly chip away at you until you are dust, or they will nuke you with a super-powerful spell, or they will go away for years and literally discover radiation on their own, then design and build a nuke to nuke you.
A friendly banterish fight between two elves goes down in legends of short-living beings. In fact, individual elves are often worshipped as Gods in even mighty large cultures (most those elves were very motivated butterfly botanists. Like raging bonkers for butterflies), though elves themselves don't really experience the same existential difficulties as humans and don't really get the concept of god or religion.
Would it have killed you put empty lines between separate ideas?

On the topic of contradictory ideas:
They can't be bothered to eat, but walk to the flower?

I like the approach of factoring in the lifespan difference into their perspective, but some aspects seem to be put there for the sake of more differences.
They still think at the same speed as humans from your descriptions, so they would need input at the same rate.
 

Snusmumriken

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This is why I haven't tackled any ancient entities myself yet lol. all my older characters are a few centuries old tops.

Don't forget that self-perception is always normal. And they could have more physiological adaptations to such long lives.

Yes, the amount of food and drink they had to consume over the years is vast...but so is the amount of blinks and breaths you take over yours. for them, these things could be literally subconscious.

I could also see them form affections with other races, just as we do with cats and dogs. Or even shorter living species.

What I could see is much more strategical rather than tactical thinking compared to us. As they would treat years as we treat days.

And are likely to form connections much longer, but would also hold to them for a longer period of time. So you might have to spend a few years to catch that passing fling of an elven maiden but said fling would likely last for the rest of your life. I could see them care for their offspring but if it is mixed they would likely avoid having such children or would treat them like kids for much longer and kinda become helicopter parents in many cases.
 

forli

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First of all, what you've described here is not what most people call 'elves'. In most stories an elf will have at most 10 times the lifespan of a human (usually less) and not be much stronger, also, regeneration is not something normally associated with elves. You're talking about some race of demigods that you've invented and called elves, but fine, let's work with that.

What you've described here is completely unrealistic.

In particular, the part about an elf adopting a human for 20 years and then forgetting about him because that was like 20 minutes for her. How long would it take the human to decide to look for his mother and then find her? Let's say about a year. How could she have possibly forgotten him by then? If you spend 20 minutes playing with a butterfly, you're not going to forget about it after just one minute. The way you described that sounded as if the elf was experiencing time super fast during those 20 years and then started experiencing time at the same rate as a human as soon as she left, it makes no sense.

Also, you said that these elves would have an insane amount of knowledge as a result of living for so long, but that would not be the case. If an elf can forget about a human that she's known for 20 years because that's the same as 20 minutes to her, it would mean that in those 20 years she only got the amount of knowledge that a human would have gotten in 20 minutes, you cannot then say that other forms of knowledge would work different, that's not how learning works. If a human can learn in a minute what it would take an elf an entire year, elves would not really be any more knowledgeable than humans.

And if elves experience time at a rate of 1 minute to 1 year. Human civilization would go from medieval to science fiction in what would feel to an elf like just a few days. Your elves would be left so far behind that nobody would take them seriously. Humans would think of elves the same that they would think of a hobo that sits on a bench all day staring into nothing.
 

owotrucked

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Well seems like I'm an elf lol.

You don't need to have infinite lifespan to have a warped sense of value. Likewise, you don't need to have a short lifespan to value day to day rituals such as eating or sleeping. (It's all a matter of personality)

But you're sharing interesting portrayals of elves with a lot of personality embedded in it.
 

Amok

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Have you ever read Frieren ? it's recommended if you are interested in elves, their warped time perception, and regrets born of it.


Wow is the art style Moebius-like? looks sorta like that on cover.
 

owotrucked

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Have you ever read Frieren ? it's recommended if you are interested in elves, their warped time perception, and regrets born of it.

Yeah, I'm a fan! Frieren acts radically different now that she's retracing the steps of her quest with Fern and Stark compared to how she was right before Himmel's death.

Even if she's an elf, her sense values does change through interacting people. She's like the embodiment of this quote: "I cannot remember the books I've read any more than the meals I have eaten; even so, they have made me." ― Ralph Waldo Emerson

She carries on the memories of her master and Himmel, expressing them through her unique quirky personality. In some ways, these are parting gifts, as she enjoys life through collecting obscure magic, helping people, and exploring dungeons.

Her second journey is a proof that Himmel's efforts were not in vain, as his memories and statues are still honored. But that's not all there is to Life, many forgotten heroes actually paved the way to victory.

She used to complain that the world change too much, so it's useless to try to interact with it and leave a mark. But at the same time, she knows that if things stayed the same, it would be stale and uninteresting.

The story carefully and gently tackles very different aspects of Time in an entertaining way.

My only complaint is that many characters feel similar to Frieren. As if many of them were similar types of containers but with different content. It feels like they are all chills, could actually tune on the same wavelength, and sort their difference with just talking. For instance, the antagonists are demons, who are designed to be evil.
 

Cipiteca396

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You've perfectly described the most common depiction of dragons, lol. Vampires sometimes have this as well.

I guess it's important to make a distinction between traits of an immortal, and traits of a species. Otherwise they all end up being the same boring cast of characters.
 

Kilolo

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i'm sorry to say this, but from what I read, you only describe what would be an immortal creature would behave if they're already live for eons.

but what about the other stuff? one that implies elf are proud race due to their long lifespan, or about how they're attached to nature and clean environment, or their seclusion tendencies, or maybe about how they're not that keen in producing offspring.

i mean, yes. ultimately elves is just a fantasy concept, there's no absolute way in how you design their lore, even the famous Harry Potter series depict elf as something very differently compared to popular lore. yet, I like it so much.

but the thing is, just like someone already said above. there's lots of thing that contradict with each other in your description.
only perceiving other race as an insect? sure, don't forget that if you make it that way then they wouldn't be able to differentiate human faces with each other (except with some oddballs). i mean, can you tell the difference of a butterfly face with the others?
but yet, you also said they're not really keen in communicating with their own race. i mean, what? are they're all supposed to be an old & obtuse philosopher or something?

and then you said they're so powerful, hoarding knowledge, and all OP stuff like that, but yet, you also said that they had no civilization whatsoever, it's like whatever the knowledge they had, none of them are bother to preserve it in a physical note, they all store it in their head. are they supposed to have photographic memory or something?

my point is: make a strong foundation first about the lore, then start branching it from there.
from what I see, you're just writing it as an individual who receive immortality at the middle of their life and be like "if it we're me, then I would go like this!"
that's not how you wrote an entire race lore.
 
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