Tag Implementation. State Here.

SquigglySquidSquish

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Now I know there's gonna be some that will argue there's too many tags already. This is not about arguing too many tags or too little. And I know there's already existing tag threads, in fact quite a few occasionally comes up, so it looks like there hasn't been much done about it. So let's consolidate to one specific thread on tag requests.

Tags you want implemented that you don't see on the site. State the tag and state the reason(s). A reason must accompany per tag requested. Keep it to a clean format to make it consistent so its easier to read what tags and what reasons. Post format:

Implement
Tag Request: ______________
Reason: _______________


Or, if there's a bunch of related tags, and you want to shrink it down to one overall topic, state those group of related tags and your reasons why. (Esp. since some argue there are some tags that should be removed and some state that some tags are perfectly fine and should stay existing to help specify a story more). A reason must accompany per tag that you want to consolidate into a general group tag overall. Keep format clean and consistent so its easier to spot. Post Format:

Tag Consolidation:
Tag (specified): __________
Reason: ________________
Tag Suggest Instead: ________________

Someone once told me that to request a tag, the way to go about it is probably to make a new thread requesting for that tag implementation.
Maybe someday there'll be one thread where we can go all to request certain tags, and those tags will actually get picked up.

**If you like the tag that is being suggested to implement or agree with a specific tag to be consolidated, then please like that comment. This way it can measure how much "demand" is for that specific tag cause that is the only way to see to it possibly get approved.**




Let me start with an example:

Tag Implementation:

Requested Tag: Heartbreak

Reason:
  • There's a tag for heartwarming, yet not a tag for heartbreak. Should have an opposite tag for heartwarming.
  • There are a couple of tags that relate to romance. Heartbreak does not have one.
  • Heartbreak does not just mean cheats, affairs, betrayal. Heartbreak can be caused by many various things in romance relationships that don't have existing tags. Heartbreak can just mean a painful relationship breaking down without any of the afore mentioned parts.
 
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Valmond

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This is probably a joke, but... No. Way too narrow and won't see any meaningful use.
Iguana hater spotted. 🥳

Well that aside, we should consider some normal ones. Such as ’no smut,’ I think that one there would be more useful. On another hand, can increase the amount of tags allowed, then allow the user to specifically type in a tag themselves. This one here is available on Inkitt.
 

SquigglySquidSquish

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Implement:
Tag Requested: Fluffiness
Reason:
  • Because I want to find romance stories that are more light-hearted and sweet filling instead of gut wrenching love triangles and soap drama.
  • Checked just in case and noted that Fluffiness is different from Wholesome.
  • Because the FLUFFINESS :D
 

AliceShiki

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Iguana hater spotted. 🥳

Well that aside, we should consider some normal ones. Such as ’no smut,’ I think that one there would be more useful. On another hand, can increase the amount of tags allowed, then allow the user to specifically type in a tag themselves. This one here is available on Inkitt.
Tags saying "No [something]" are unnecessary. You can just use the series finder to exclude the smut genre.
Implement:
Tag Requested: Fluffiness
Reason:
  • Because I want to find romance stories that are more light-hearted and sweet filling instead of gut wrenching love triangles and soap drama.
  • Checked just in case and noted that Fluffiness is different from Wholesome.
  • Because the FLUFFINESS :D
There is a Heartwarming tag, and a Cute Story tag if memory serves me right (I'm on phone and too lazy to double check). One of those two should fit the bill.
 

Valmond

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Tags saying "No [something]" are unnecessary. You can just use the series finder to exclude the smut genre.

There is a Heartwarming tag, and a Cute Story tag if memory serves me right (I'm on phone and too lazy to double check). One of those two should fit the bill.
Oh yeah, keep forgetting that’s actually a genre on here. Hmm... Well, guess the last thing one can do, is to allow manual tag creation. This way if a tag is not present, they can input it. At the same time, keep the current recommendation list of tags. The recommendations can be for those who are not certain on what to type, the manual input are for getting down to the finer point.
 

SquigglySquidSquish

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Oh yeah, keep forgetting that’s actually a genre on here. Hmm... Well, guess the last thing one can do, is to allow manual tag creation. This way if a tag is not present, they can input it. At the same time, keep the current recommendation list of tags. The recommendations can be for those who are not certain on what to type, the manual input are for getting down to the finer point.
While I do like that and many people also want see it implemented as they have commented on this in several other threads, this thread is specifically for requesting specific tags. Please only put tag and reason to be implemented so it makes it easier to see wheres the tag requested and reason why.

Tags saying "No [something]" are unnecessary. You can just use the series finder to exclude the smut genre.

There is a Heartwarming tag, and a Cute Story tag if memory serves me right (I'm on phone and too lazy to double check). One of those two should fit the bill.
I see. I still wish to see a heartbreak tag.
 

someguysomeone

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tag requested.
warm literary fiction.

reason
There is no tag for this.
Where it's slice of life but deep.
a realistic hard and happy life not a idealistic one or one with danger and plot armor.
what if you wanted to read a slice of life but dark. There is romantic comedy. funny moments. there is fun explanations of how world works.
spreading knowledge helping people.
and then there is
people suffering from stress because every second they wait someone is dying and
then ultimately giving up
while there always being a blanket of thought which overlaps happiness.
the happiness is real but there is darkness too.

there is letting people die because of being unable to handle too much stress and recognizing it's a lost cause and that saving someone else is better.
this is infrequent but between sappy heartwarming it's all there.
it's not fictional love no one would risk life for anyone else .
it's mundane and pragmatic.
with a dash of a unfettered goal which is selfish and above love for friends which keeps the plot moving.
it's not broody at all.
there are lots of moments of affection.
it's all this but still trying to make it a slice of life.
there is not much action or life and death.
but success and loss and aging and chipping away at success after regions of constant failures
 

Valmond

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Ya know, there is a tag I am surprised hasn’t been up there.

Augmentation

Given this site, and its stories on top of this. I feel like it would have a purpose in a range of genres.
 

yansusustories

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Tags saying "No [something]" are unnecessary. You can just use the series finder to exclude the smut genre.
I agree that this is often an option but I think it is not the case for "no smut". Now, we don't have a list with explanations on SH but at least on NU, the "Smut" Genre is defined as such:
Erotic work of fiction that's mainly targeted toward females. Smut stories often gives heavy focus on love and relationships between the main characters.
So a story that gets "smut" as a genre should have quite the heavy focus on it. E.g., I'd expect a story in that genre to have several, probably regular smut scenes. A story that - for example - only features one or two sex scenes is by no means in the right place in the smut genre but still contains smut. We don't have a "smut" tag or a "no smut" tag to distinguish either of these stories though so we are unable to either search for "no smut" stories directly or filter out any and all "smut" stories by excluding that tag. And there are (especially in the romance genre) stories that focus on love and relationships but don't contain any smut. And I think there should be a way to find those.

So maybe not a "no smut" tag, but then at least a "smut" tag but I don't think anyone would agree with that because "We have Smut as a genre already!" which isn't the same at all. One smut scene in a 100k words novel doesn't put it in the smut genre, three such scenes in a 500k words series don't make it one either. But it also doesn't make them "no smut" projects. There simply is no way to filter for them right now.
 

SquigglySquidSquish

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Tag Implement:
tag requested.
warm literary fiction.
If its warm literary fiction it sounds like wholesome or that Slice of Life genre.
reason
There is no tag for this.
Where it's slice of life but deep.
a realistic hard and happy life not a idealistic one or one with danger and plot armor.
what if you wanted to read a slice of life but dark. There is romantic comedy. funny moments. there is fun explanations of how world works.
spreading knowledge helping people.
and then there is
people suffering from stress because every second they wait someone is dying and
then ultimately giving up
while there always being a blanket of thought which overlaps happiness.
the happiness is real but there is darkness too.

there is letting people die because of being unable to handle too much stress and recognizing it's a lost cause and that saving someone else is better.
this is infrequent but between sappy heartwarming it's all there.
it's not fictional love no one would risk life for anyone else .
it's mundane and pragmatic.
with a dash of a unfettered goal which is selfish and above love for friends which keeps the plot moving.
it's not broody at all.
there are lots of moments of affection.
it's all this but still trying to make it a slice of life.
there is not much action or life and death.
but success and loss and aging and chipping away at success after regions of constant failures
From the get go, you want a realistic fiction tag?
I think of Contemporary or Modern stories to be realistic. That's kinda why I wish those are actual genres, but that is different story in another thread for now.
 

Moonpearl

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I agree that this is often an option but I think it is not the case for "no smut". Now, we don't have a list with explanations on SH but at least on NU, the "Smut" Genre is defined as such:

So a story that gets "smut" as a genre should have quite the heavy focus on it. E.g., I'd expect a story in that genre to have several, probably regular smut scenes. A story that - for example - only features one or two sex scenes is by no means in the right place in the smut genre but still contains smut. We don't have a "smut" tag or a "no smut" tag to distinguish either of these stories though so we are unable to either search for "no smut" stories directly or filter out any and all "smut" stories by excluding that tag. And there are (especially in the romance genre) stories that focus on love and relationships but don't contain any smut. And I think there should be a way to find those.

So maybe not a "no smut" tag, but then at least a "smut" tag but I don't think anyone would agree with that because "We have Smut as a genre already!" which isn't the same at all. One smut scene in a 100k words novel doesn't put it in the smut genre, three such scenes in a 500k words series don't make it one either. But it also doesn't make them "no smut" projects. There simply is no way to filter for them right now.
You can filter out any stories with the "Sexual Content" warning in the series finder, currently.
 

yansusustories

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You can filter out any stories with the "Sexual Content" warning in the series finder, currently.
Ah, yes, I guess those might work. It's kinda strange nobody mentioned them before. Also, I still sorely miss a list of what exactly should be put under which content warning (like the tags and the genres ...) but I guess that'd be a topic for another thread.
 

AliceShiki

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Oh yeah, keep forgetting that’s actually a genre on here. Hmm... Well, guess the last thing one can do, is to allow manual tag creation. This way if a tag is not present, they can input it. At the same time, keep the current recommendation list of tags. The recommendations can be for those who are not certain on what to type, the manual input are for getting down to the finer point.
NU used to have Manual Tag creation... It was a complete mess and way too much work to clean up. Especially because manual tag creation allows people to create a "Transported into another world" tag when a "Transported to another world" tag also exists. Took a lot of effort to clean those 1200ish tags into 700ish, and getting rid of manual tag creation was a fantastic movement.

... Also, only authors control their tags in Scribbly, so we can't even fix it when someone creates a whole new tag because of a typo, which would lead to unnecessary tag bloat... Manual tag creation would just be awful, really.
tag requested.
warm literary fiction.

reason
There is no tag for this.
Where it's slice of life but deep.
a realistic hard and happy life not a idealistic one or one with danger and plot armor.
what if you wanted to read a slice of life but dark. There is romantic comedy. funny moments. there is fun explanations of how world works.
spreading knowledge helping people.
and then there is
people suffering from stress because every second they wait someone is dying and
then ultimately giving up
while there always being a blanket of thought which overlaps happiness.
the happiness is real but there is darkness too.

there is letting people die because of being unable to handle too much stress and recognizing it's a lost cause and that saving someone else is better.
this is infrequent but between sappy heartwarming it's all there.
it's not fictional love no one would risk life for anyone else .
it's mundane and pragmatic.
with a dash of a unfettered goal which is selfish and above love for friends which keeps the plot moving.
it's not broody at all.
there are lots of moments of affection.
it's all this but still trying to make it a slice of life.
there is not much action or life and death.
but success and loss and aging and chipping away at success after regions of constant failures
"Warm Literary Fiction" falls into Heartwarming.

Your big paragraphs below don't seem to reflect what I'd consider as "warm"... I dunno exactly what you want, but the concept seems too vague and not very useful.
Requested Tag: Shenmo
Reason:
  • Shenmo means of gods and demons fiction, a chinese fantasy fiction genre. It doesn't mean its xianxia since its not really about cultivation.
  • If its not counted as a genre on SH since not many use it here, by any chance could it still be added somewhere as a tag?
  • https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gods_and_demons_fiction
I don't think that's very useful because I think most people never heard of this word.
 

SquigglySquidSquish

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I don't think that's very useful because I think most people never heard of this word.
Ik thats why I'm requesting just for the future. I'll probably request again someday. Working on something. Most people don't know but eventually people will learn about it. Before people don't know a lot of xianxia, xuanhuan and wuxia now more people do.
 

Valmond

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NU used to have Manual Tag creation... It was a complete mess and way too much work to clean up. Especially because manual tag creation allows people to create a "Transported into another world" tag when a "Transported to another world" tag also exists. Took a lot of effort to clean those 1200ish tags into 700ish, and getting rid of manual tag creation was a fantastic movement.

... Also, only authors control their tags in Scribbly, so we can't even fix it when someone creates a whole new tag because of a typo, which would lead to unnecessary tag bloat... Manual tag creation would just be awful, really.

"Warm Literary Fiction" falls into Heartwarming.

Your big paragraphs below don't seem to reflect what I'd consider as "warm"... I dunno exactly what you want, but the concept seems too vague and not very useful.

I don't think that's very useful because I think most people never heard of this word.
On another hand, Inkitt works quite well with the manual tags. It might be due to the interface, as well as those that manage the site. However, I haven’t seen an issue really on that site with using the manual creation method. It can simply be due to mismanagement that caused the mess in the first place. Even Wattpad uses the manual tag creation, and that is a massive company.

And well, scribblehub also has the tag block feature in place. So that could help cut down on tags, then there is the whole 25 tags max someone can have. This really brings a limit to how much someone can put in. Given how the feature works, it will transition just fine.

And for some reason I thought of a smut tag. Well for the laughs I guess.

Rice Crispy.

😂

Strangely I think it can actually work, that is what I am horrified of. :blob_blank:
 
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AliceShiki

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It can simply be due to mismanagement that caused the mess in the first place.
I was directly involved in cleaning up the tags in NU... It was not mismanagement, the manual tag addition system just sucks.

Like, sure, it was functional, but it required checking the edit logs daily to see if anyone messed up and created a new tag due to a typo, or if they re-created a new tag that was just deleted a day ago... It was a serious pain.

... And well, it was still functional just because we could actually clean up those messes. In Scribbly where only authors can control the tags in their story... Well, it's just horrible. Unless you are saying that having 3000+ tags is having a functional system, which is something I heavily disagree with.

PS: I tried browsing Wattpad very quickly just to see how their tagging system works... They don't seem to have any way to search by tags, so... I don't think it's comparable.
Also, on a quick search I found the following tags: Kids, Children, Child, Childrensstories, Toddler, Baby, Babies.
I also found Adorable, Sweet and Cute on a different search
Oh, Fluff and Fluffy too.

I don't see how that can be considered a functional system in any way. It's clearly redundant and in need of a cleanup, yet that will never happen, so the redundancy remains.

I can imagine Inkitt has the same issues, but I'm too lazy to check.
 
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Valmond

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I was directly involved in cleaning up the tags in NU... It was not mismanagement, the manual tag addition system just sucks.

Like, sure, it was functional, but it required checking the edit logs daily to see if anyone messed up and created a new tag due to a typo, or if they re-created a new tag that was just deleted a day ago... It was a serious pain.

... And well, it was still functional just because we could actually clean up those messes. In Scribbly where only authors can control the tags in their story... Well, it's just horrible. Unless you are saying that having 3000+ tags is having a functional system, which is something I heavily disagree with.

PS: I tried browsing Wattpad very quickly just to see how their tagging system works... They don't seem to have any way to search by tags, so... I don't think it's comparable.
Also, on a quick search I found the following tags: Kids, Children, Child, Childrensstories, Toddler, Baby, Babies.
I also found Adorable, Sweet and Cute on a different search
Oh, Fluff and Fluffy too.

I don't see how that can be considered a functional system in any way. It's clearly redundant and in need of a cleanup, yet that will never happen, so the redundancy remains.

I can imagine Inkitt has the same issues, but I'm too lazy to check.
I did mention that scribblehub has 25 tags max per story. Meaning it would be cut down upon, unlike Inkitt that can have 100 tags or something. There wouldn’t be the same fluctuation, not by a massive margin. I can see where you are coming from. Also, you cannot call it just sucks. You gotta give reasons on why it does. Functionally speaking manually adding tags gives more leeway to the author. Yes, we can see this might be a problem on its own. However, we now have to look at other factors on scribblehub specifically.

If users adds their own tags, you’d need a way to self regulate. Otherwise it can be flooded when users go to search. Hence, it has a tag filtering system. In combination with the usual breakdown, one can add in the tags they do not wish to see. This will further break it down. Then there is the 25 max tags per story, which puts a limit on how much can go in. Given the current setup, it can work, since it has other measures in place to help keep it in check.

So we can break this down further.

-Genre

-Tags

-Well, potential triggering elements

Genres - Can be removed to further lower the pool shown

Tags - Can be removed to narrow it even more

Those three check boxes at the bottom - These can be checked or unchecked to either increase availability or decrease it

25 tags - This prevents someone doing 100 random tags.

Next, one has to account for the growth of the site. When new users come in, you’re gonna have issues. Whether without this feature or not. More books that are created, more potential tags that will be out there. Then here is the finest point. When running a site, or anything else as a matter. It is important to have accessibility, while regulating it. The site already has the regulation in place, it simply needs the accessibility factor of it.

As for Wattpad’s tag system, not sure if they still have it, but you can block a certain number of tags. As for how the search works. It is from the search bar, once searching for something. There are recommendations at the top to further add on tags to narrow down what you want to find.
 

SquigglySquidSquish

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Next, one has to account for the growth of the site. When new users come in, you’re gonna have issues. Whether without this feature or not. More books that are created, more potential tags that will be out there. Then here is the finest point. When running a site, or anything else as a matter. It is important to have accessibility, while regulating it. The site already has the regulation in place, it simply needs the accessibility factor of it.
Agree. That's why suggestion tags are here in the first place. People are going to use it potentially. The tags I suggest I am planning to write a story like that. And we have duplicate or similar related tags that can be reduced and grouped even more to reduce so many tags.
 

Valmond

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Agree. That's why suggestion tags are here in the first place. People are going to use it potentially. The tags I suggest I am planning to write a story like that. And we have duplicate or similar related tags that can be reduced and grouped even more to reduce so many tags.
Yeah, I understand it can get tricky the larger a site. Well, I suppose the other solution is to add as many tags as one can think of as a preset. That would be an alternative. Damn, I know I once looked up tags and there was a list suggested. It was back when I was stuck on what tags to use. Well, I’ll probably remember what is it at some point.

Anyway, to be honest. Scribblehubs filter system is one of the better ones I have used. So I don’t see an issue with either options. Manual or a hell of a long data base of preset tags. Either can work well.
 
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