Tag Implementation. State Here.

SquigglySquidSquish

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Now I know there's gonna be some that will argue there's too many tags already. This is not about arguing too many tags or too little. And I know there's already existing tag threads, in fact quite a few occasionally comes up, so it looks like there hasn't been much done about it. So let's consolidate to one specific thread on tag requests.

Tags you want implemented that you don't see on the site. State the tag and state the reason(s). A reason must accompany per tag requested. Keep it to a clean format to make it consistent so its easier to read what tags and what reasons. Post format:

Implement
Tag Request: ______________
Reason: _______________


Or, if there's a bunch of related tags, and you want to shrink it down to one overall topic, state those group of related tags and your reasons why. (Esp. since some argue there are some tags that should be removed and some state that some tags are perfectly fine and should stay existing to help specify a story more). A reason must accompany per tag that you want to consolidate into a general group tag overall. Keep format clean and consistent so its easier to spot. Post Format:

Tag Consolidation:
Tag (specified): __________
Reason: ________________
Tag Suggest Instead: ________________

Someone once told me that to request a tag, the way to go about it is probably to make a new thread requesting for that tag implementation.
Maybe someday there'll be one thread where we can go all to request certain tags, and those tags will actually get picked up.

**If you like the tag that is being suggested to implement or agree with a specific tag to be consolidated, then please like that comment. This way it can measure how much "demand" is for that specific tag cause that is the only way to see to it possibly get approved.**




Let me start with an example:

Tag Implementation:

Requested Tag: Heartbreak

Reason:
  • There's a tag for heartwarming, yet not a tag for heartbreak. Should have an opposite tag for heartwarming.
  • There are a couple of tags that relate to romance. Heartbreak does not have one.
  • Heartbreak does not just mean cheats, affairs, betrayal. Heartbreak can be caused by many various things in romance relationships that don't have existing tags. Heartbreak can just mean a painful relationship breaking down without any of the afore mentioned parts.
 
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AliceShiki

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Also, you cannot call it just sucks. You gotta give reasons on why it does.
Because it forced mods and helpers to check the edit logs daily to see if anyone messed up adding a tag by putting a typo or something similar?

Because it allows the creation of tons of redundant tags?

Because it allows users to recreate tags that were recently removed/renamed?

Pretty sure I gave multiple reasons as to why the system sucked.
25 tags - This prevents someone doing 100 random tags.
Tag count won't raise a significant amount due to one person/story, but by multiple people creating redundant tags and tags with typos in them and tags that shorten terms that others spell out and super narrow and mostly useless tags... Among other things.

25 tags limit is irrelevant.
Damn, I know I once looked up tags and there was a list suggested. It was back when I was stuck on what tags to use. Well, I’ll probably remember what is it at some point.
When you try creating a story and click the tags part, a dropdown menu with all tags of Scribbly show up. You can type something in it to filter out the results or you can scroll through everything manually.

Same can be done in the Series Finder.
 

Valmond

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Because it forced mods and helpers to check the edit logs daily to see if anyone messed up adding a tag by putting a typo or something similar?

Because it allows the creation of tons of redundant tags?

Because it allows users to recreate tags that were recently removed/renamed?

Pretty sure I gave multiple reasons as to why the system sucked.

Tag count won't raise a significant amount due to one person/story, but by multiple people creating redundant tags and tags with typos in them and tags that shorten terms that others spell out and super narrow and mostly useless tags... Among other things.

25 tags limit is irrelevant.

When you try creating a story and click the tags part, a dropdown menu with all tags of Scribbly show up. You can type something in it to filter out the results or you can scroll through everything manually.

Same can be done in the Series Finder.
Then here is my question. Why does it work? As I said, Wattpad is massive, they use the same system. It works out quite well. Then there is inkitt that does the same, if not taking it a bit further. The point is for accessibility.

I can understand potential problems that can come with it. However, it still remains that there is a process to reduce the amount of tags in an efficient manner. Which exists already on the sight.

Also, as for the redundant tags? It is already being done. Hell, for all of my stories currently. I use redundant tags, since it all follows a similar line. Hence, I use the same tags. Given the system, if it suggests one work, it would do so as well with all of the works. This is to be expected, despite everything. There will be redundant tags with or without the system in place. It will just be done in a slightly different way.

Now recreate tags that were recently removed. You actually just listed a benefit. Certain tags work better for a story. However, there can be a number of factors that goes into removing it. It can even simply be that it may not seem worth keeping in. Well, it may not seem worth keeping in at the time. However, the market always changes, meaning if it shifts, and the time is right. Those tags can once again shift where the direction is going. This is part of the competitive world.

On another note, spelling errors I can understand this. It happens, though the system should be able to automatically filter it out if and when it is changed. As for mostly useless tags, this here is an irrelevant opinion. Sometimes, certain variations of a tag might work better.

As you said, with the series finder it can filter out tags based on what is entered in. For it to work more efficiently such as manual entry, the input would have to allow entry into it physically. This would help to expand it.

As for the 25 tag limit. It is actually critical. Allow me to take you back to when Wattpad used to allow 100 tags. Due to the amount, it greatly increased exposure, by reducing it to 25 now. That actually limited visibility, and caused things to really slow down. So, 25 tags goes a long way in reducing what others can do. This here, it is fine to stay 25. Due to the overflow that can happen as a result of it being longer. Now combine this with the filter system, it becomes a lot easier to eliminate tags.

In short, there are certain phrases people use. By eliminating those potential phrases, it can further. You never gave reasons on why it sucked. You gave reasons on why you dislike it. Which I accept, though, it really hasn’t proven anything.

——————————————

Anyway, I am honestly surprised this is not a tag.

Diverse/Diversity

It seems quite a basic one to have for multiple reasons. For one, it can help to signal that the story is more open to other races, or even sexual orientation. Simple yet effective.
 
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SquigglySquidSquish

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I agree with both @Valmond and see some of @AliceShiki points, but please use this thread specifically to request a tag.
And yes, I'm tired of redundant tags, there are several tags for popular tropes that can be reduced to one, and there you have it, you reduced the amount of unnecessary tags that some keep talking about. That way you have more room for other tags which also deserve a spot on the tag list. A lot of these tags on here requested are because we can't find the right tag for our story that is close to it. The stories I want to write (not published on here yet) -its hard to find the right tags and I have to think for awhile what genre or tag to even put on the story because the other ones don't fit it that well.

The argument of commenting for and against manual tags has already been done in several other threads. Please reserve this one specifically to request a tag. Hate to be picky about this, but please stay with the consistent format so its easier to read. Underline tag and reason so its easier to see what tag you are mentioning because sometimes the thread goes a bit off topic and it takes awhile to find tag and reason in the comment.
 

AliceShiki

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Then here is my question. Why does it work? As I said, Wattpad is massive, they use the same system. It works out quite well. Then there is inkitt that does the same, if not taking it a bit further. The point is for accessibility.
The system quite clearly doesn't work properly, they have 6 different tags for children that should be merged into one.

You are guaranteed to miss out on a bunch of stories no matter what tags you search for because of the redundancy, that's not a functional system.
Also, as for the redundant tags? It is already being done. Hell, for all of my stories currently. I use redundant tags, since it all follows a similar line. Hence, I use the same tags. Given the system, if it suggests one work, it would do so as well with all of the works. This is to be expected, despite everything. There will be redundant tags with or without the system in place. It will just be done in a slightly different way.
Highlight the tags you believe to be redundant and ask for them to be removed then.

I can't think of any redundant tags from the top of my head (except maybe Heartwarming/Cute Story, but that's debatable), though there are certainly some tags I consider useless and worth removing.
Anyway, I am honestly surprised this is not a tag.

Diverse/Diversity

It seems quite a basic one to have for multiple reasons. For one, it can help to signal that the story is more open to other races, or even sexual orientation. Simple yet effective.
Seems too broad and doesn't really say anything in particular because it's excessively open. I don't see that being very useful.
The argument of commenting for and against manual tags has already been done in several other threads. Please reserve this one specifically to request a tag. Hate to be picky about this, but please stay with the consistent format so its easier to read. Underline tag and reason so its easier to see what tag you are mentioning because sometimes the thread goes a bit off topic and it takes awhile to find tag and reason in the comment.
I think it's worthwhile to discuss rather or not a tag is worth implementing, but I guess we did take the manual tag discussion a bit too far, my bad.
 

SquigglySquidSquish

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I think it's worthwhile to discuss rather or not a tag is worth implementing, but I guess we did take the manual tag discussion a bit too far, my bad.
It is worth it to discuss why a specific tag should be impelemented of not. The problem is when it goes off into another manual vs don't add more tags thread, its not talking about that specific tag but many tags in general.

Thu, tbh, I do kinda feel like this thread is pointless. Maybe having a thread requesting one tag may be implemented more, but then again, I don't think I have seen the other tags threads for one specific tag being implemented. And nice to have tags all in one thread.
 

Valmond

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The system quite clearly doesn't work properly, they have 6 different tags for children that should be merged into one.

You are guaranteed to miss out on a bunch of stories no matter what tags you search for because of the redundancy, that's not a functional system.

Highlight the tags you believe to be redundant and ask for them to be removed then.

I can't think of any redundant tags from the top of my head (except maybe Heartwarming/Cute Story, but that's debatable), though there are certainly some tags I consider useless and worth removing.

Seems too broad and doesn't really say anything in particular because it's excessively open. I don't see that being very useful.

I think it's worthwhile to discuss rather or not a tag is worth implementing, but I guess we did take the manual tag discussion a bit too far, my bad.
I understand where you are coming from but, none of your points are supported. At least not strongly enough to warrant the removal of something, as or the limitation of a feature. As I said though I accept where you are coming from, I respect it, and I apologize for my part in it all.

Now I can understand combining some tags if it does exactly the same thing, but really. The English language is quite a complex one, even some of the same words can mean something else. Let’s take a basic one such as ‘Read’ and ‘Read.’ It works both present and past. To be reading something as well as can mean that one has already read something.

We can take ‘compact’ when used as an adjective it means something small. When as a verb it means something smaller. We can also use something like ‘desert’ which it can refer to a place of little rain, or the abandonment of a person or cause. This goes on for sometime, point is can’t really go removing words on the fly. Since even similar words can mean something different.

Though if the words are similar and means the same thing. Then that would be fine, just got to be careful on which one goes.

As for the diverse/diversity tag.


This here can fall into a number of genres.

Romance

LGBTQ+

Fantasy

Tragedy

Etc.

To break it down further, this goes into more along things such as race. Alignments, country, morals, etc. When I think of the tag, I think of it more along these lines. Expecting multiple fronts, a diverse story goes beyond, and incorporates many elements. If this is not clear enough, which word would you suggest? I am certain there is another one out there, just can’t think of it currently.
 

AliceShiki

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As for the diverse/diversity tag.


This here can fall into a number of genres.

Romance

LGBTQ+

Fantasy

Tragedy

Etc.

To break it down further, this goes into more along things such as race. Alignments, country, morals, etc. When I think of the tag, I think of it more along these lines. Expecting multiple fronts, a diverse story goes beyond, and incorporates many elements. If this is not clear enough, which word would you suggest? I am certain there is another one out there, just can’t think of it currently.
That's way too broad, tags shouldn't be broad enough to the point you have to look at half of the other tags within the story to have a notion of what it means for the story in question.
 

Valmond

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That's way too broad, tags shouldn't be broad enough to the point you have to look at half of the other tags within the story to have a notion of what it means for the story in question.
Alright, so given the context of it. What would be a term to narrow it down? Since they have the genre specifics yes, but what would be a term to further trigger a connecting point?

Since well, this is a pretty important point over quite some years really. So far I can just think of one term, but it only covers one part of it all.

Mixed-race.

Unless breaking this down into its own individual category.

multiracial can work as well. Which gets a bit clearer I suppose I can say.
 

SquigglySquidSquish

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Alright, so given the context of it. What would be a term to narrow it down? Since they have the genre specifics yes, but what would be a term to further trigger a connecting point?

Since well, this is a pretty important point over quite some years really. So far I can just think of one term, but it only covers one part of it all.

Mixed-race.

Unless breaking this down into its own individual category.

multiracial can work as well. Which gets a bit clearer I suppose I can say.
@Valmond

Tag: The Tag
Reason:
- Argument 1
- Argument 2

Half the time I do agree with most of your comments but the other part is also trying to search which part is responding to aliceshiki and which part is actually talking about a specific tag.
 

Valmond

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@Valmond

Tag: The Tag
Reason:
- Argument 1
- Argument 2

Half the time I do agree with most of your comments but the other part is also trying to search which part is responding to aliceshiki and which part is actually talking about a specific tag.
It’s sort of a mixed bag at this point. Now it is now on the tagging part to clarify. If diverse/diversity is too broad. Then right now is trying to figure out what can narrow it down.

Maybe mixed-race wouldn’t necessarily work on multiple fronts. So I am thinking what about, ‘multiracial’?

While this does not cover everything, it does narrow it down to the point of it being that the story will contain multiple races and ethnic groups. Whether it is real or not. This has been a recurring issue pretty much everywhere I go. There are readers looking for this sort of diversity, yet they cannot find it. As a result, I am thinking at least on this front. The multiracial tag can work.
 
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Malonymous

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Implement
Tag Request: Villainess Noble Girls Subplot / [Pseudo] Villainess Noble Girls
Reason:
Although my novel is not an Otome Game story, early on I was suggested to add the Villainess Noble Girls tag as the MC arguably fit the trope. So I created a poll to let readers vote if the tag fit the story, and then a majority voted 'Yes'. So I added the tag. Then a lot of 'No' votes came in and tied the vote. So I removed the tag. Then a lot of 'Yes' votes came in. So I—No, my heart can't take this any more!!

Tag goes up, 'No' goes up. Tag goes down, 'Yes' goes up. This is a war that will rage for eternity. There will be no end to this bloodshed until there is justice for non-Otome Game Villainess Noble Girls. Do you know what they have to go through every day of their lives?!?

These girls deserve to be loved, too!!! :blob_hmph::blob_hmph::blob_hmph:

Seriously though, I too thought that Villainess Noble Girls were a trope specifically for Otome Game stories. The NUF tag definition for VNG certainly suggests as much. But then I discovered something surprising doing research.

SH currently has 45 novels tagged with Otome Game and 115 tagged with VNG. Of those 115, 25 also have the Otome Game tag, and 90 are tagged with VNG but not Otome Game. Sure, some of them could be mistagged, but still; for an 'Otome Game trope,' there are almost four times more VNG novels that aren't tagged with Otome Game!!

So now I'm wondering... what exactly is the definition of the Villainess Noble Girls tag?
 
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Implement
Tag Request: Villainess Noble Girls Subplot / [Pseudo] Villainess Noble Girls
Reason:
Although my novel is not an Otome Game story, early on I was suggested to add the Villainess Noble Girls tag as the MC arguably fit the trope. So I created a poll to let readers vote if the tag fit the story, and then a majority voted 'Yes'. So I added the tag. Then a lot of 'No' votes came in and tied the vote. So I removed the tag. Then a lot of 'Yes' votes came in. So I—No, my heart can't take this any more!!

Tag goes up, 'No' goes up. Tag goes down, 'Yes' goes up. This is a war that will rage for eternity. There will be no end to this bloodshed until there is justice for non-Otome Game Villainess Noble Girls. Do you know what they have to go through every day of their lives?!?

These girls deserve to be loved, too!!! :blob_hmph::blob_hmph::blob_hmph:

Seriously though, I too thought that Villainess Noble Girls were a trope specifically for Otome Game stories. The NUF tag definition for VNG certainly suggests as much. But then I discovered something surprising doing research.

SH currently has 45 novels tagged with Otome Game and 115 tagged with VNG. Of those 115, 25 also have the Otome Game tag, and 90 are tagged with VNG but not Otome Game. Sure, some of them could be mistagged, but still; for an 'Otome Game trope,' there are almost four times more VNG novels that aren't tagged with Otome Game!!

So now I'm wondering... what exactly is the definition of the Villainess Noble Girls tag?
Can't you just close the poll?
 

Malonymous

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Can't you just close the poll?
I will lol. I just think it's interesting how people have different interpretations of the tag that leads to a real 'can't please everyone' situation. The safe solution is to just go without the tag of course, but I'm still wondering about the definition of it here. It's probably one of those things that everyone can't agree on anyway 🤷‍♀️
 

AliceShiki

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Implement
Tag Request: Villainess Noble Girls Subplot / [Pseudo] Villainess Noble Girls
Reason:
Although my novel is not an Otome Game story, early on I was suggested to add the Villainess Noble Girls tag as the MC arguably fit the trope. So I created a poll to let readers vote if the tag fit the story, and then a majority voted 'Yes'. So I added the tag. Then a lot of 'No' votes came in and tied the vote. So I removed the tag. Then a lot of 'Yes' votes came in. So I—No, my heart can't take this any more!!

Tag goes up, 'No' goes up. Tag goes down, 'Yes' goes up. This is a war that will rage for eternity. There will be no end to this bloodshed until there is justice for non-Otome Game Villainess Noble Girls. Do you know what they have to go through every day of their lives?!?

These girls deserve to be loved, too!!! :blob_hmph::blob_hmph::blob_hmph:

Seriously though, I too thought that Villainess Noble Girls were a trope specifically for Otome Game stories. The NUF tag definition for VNG certainly suggests as much. But then I discovered something surprising doing research.

SH currently has 45 novels tagged with Otome Game and 115 tagged with VNG. Of those 115, 25 also have the Otome Game tag, and 90 are tagged with VNG but not Otome Game. Sure, some of them could be mistagged, but still; for an 'Otome Game trope,' there are almost four times more VNG novels that aren't tagged with Otome Game!!

So now I'm wondering... what exactly is the definition of the Villainess Noble Girls tag?
I don't think the subplot/pseudo tags would be very useful because it's too subjective...

As to what the definition of VNG is... Usually it is used for Girls that die and reincarnate into the world of an Otome Game/Shoujo Manga/Novel/Something that they interacted with in their previous life... And then well, they're the villainess of the story and stuff (easy examples are Reika-sama and Bakarina).

But it's not really the only usage. Another trope that fits well with VNG is on 2nd chance novels for example, where the MC was branded as a villainess, executed and what not, and then has the chance to get back to the past to change things around (Like The Abandoned Empress and Actually I Was The Real One).

And uhn... I guess stories where the MC just happens to be a noble girl and happens to be in a position that somehow resembles a villainess... I think in those stories the tag could fit as well. Though those are somewhat rarer.
 

CadmarLegend

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Translated Novels are mostly hidden and are ridiculously hard to find normally. You can't even find them by using the Search function, nor can you find them with the Series Finder.

They also don't appear in the latest releases section as well.

I have no idea how you can across them perchance by browsing Scribblehub, because they are well-hidden, really. I don't see a reason to add anything else to further hide them when they're already super hidden by default. Most of the time you only find Translations in Scribblehub when you come from their Novel Page in Novelupdates.
Yeah. I was so confused when one day, a few days after uploading a few of my translated chapters, I suddenly couldn't find the novels using the search function.... I was worried that they got taken down or something until I went to my profile and saw that they were fine and dandy.

And with how many stories are on Scribble Hub, if a novel can't be found using the search bar, and it's not going to get on to trending or 'Latest Updates', that novel's as good as not even being on the site. You'd need an external link to help get there....
 

SquigglySquidSquish

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Yeah. I was so confused when one day, a few days after uploading a few of my translated chapters, I suddenly couldn't find the novels using the search function.... I was worried that they got taken down or something until I went to my profile and saw that they were fine and dandy.

And with how many stories are on Scribble Hub, if a novel can't be found using the search bar, and it's not going to get on to trending or 'Latest Updates', that novel's as good as not even being on the site. You'd need an external link to help get there....
guess must be interesting that day found it on trending. unique occurence.
 

CadmarLegend

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guess must be interesting that day found it on trending. unique occurence.
Yeah. I wasn't warned of anything that said that the novel was going to disappear from the search bar, and up until about 1 day ago (in that time frame), it had been easy to search it up on the search bar, just for fun, so I was VERY surprised.
 
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SquigglySquidSquish

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Tag: ocean
Reason:
  • some of us may want to read stories that are more ocean themed.
  • ocean/sea is the setting or could be one of the main focuses of the story too.
 

AliceShiki

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Tag: ocean
Reason:
  • some of us may want to read stories that are more ocean themed.
  • ocean/sea is the setting or could be one of the main focuses of the story too.
I don't disagree that it could be useful, but this looks like a tag that would be heavily misused and appear on any story with any sort of ship in it.
 
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