How do you deal with a declining viewcount trend on your story?

[Aaky]

Are you sure your view-count is actually declining? I would ask this because your daily views look relatively stable and your chapter views don't look too much different than what you should expect. All authors have a small continuous dip in views and engagement the longer your story gets, here's my individual chapter views and the date they were published and you can see that reader engagement is strongly logarithmic. The longer your story gets the flatter and more stable your recent chapter viewership. This happens regardless of how popular your story is.
View attachment 5741View attachment 5742

Most of my daily readers are on older chapters, some chapters are more popular than others, maybe because of the names I don't really know, but none of them break this trend. Each release you make will push more people to read older chapters, but your newest chapters will generally have fewer views by a small margin each time. New readers need to catch up, and not all of them make it to the end.

This is a really good post, and I want to thank you for providing such an amazing and consistent level of data. Did you plotted this in Matlab or something? haha

 

[TheTrinary]

It just depends why you are writing honestly. If you are writing for popularity, yea it sucks and you should probably give up. But you shouldn't be writing for popularity. You gotta write the thing you want to write. And then you put it out there and what happens happens. If you try to write for popularity you're going to make something that can't be loved.

 

[CL]

Numbers, numbers, numbers... What I just read were writers who are more passionate about their math than literature. This whole thread sounded like a business meeting. Am I that far away from the truth?

 

[SilvCrimBlac]

Not when there's a story with more views yet a fourth of the wordcount.

And I'm still seeing entitled bitching. Woe is me I'm not the prettiest pony in the field anymore!! Woe is me!! They don't recognize my greatness!! Woe is me!! Still one of the most popular writers here...and still crying. Are you sure your adult enough to be here? Greedy too?

Grow up or stop writing. Thank you.

 

[SilvCrimBlac]

Numbers, numbers, numbers... What I just read were writers who are more passionate about their math than literature. This whole thread sounded like a business meeting. Am I that far away from the truth?

This whole thread is bullshit. I avoid those threads involving discussion posts discussing the trending tab and ones concerning 1-stars because I just get disgusted with everyone in them. Seems I have to avoid these sorts too.

 

[CL]

This whole thread is bullshit. I avoid those threads involving discussion posts discussing the trending tab and ones concerning 1-stars because I just get disgusted with everyone in them. Seems I have to avoid these sorts too.

That's because this is a pet peeve of mine: professionals vs. hobbyists.

The community is what gives meaning to the website as a whole. A lot of people have stated that this place is becoming toxic. It's not. Trust me when I say it is not toxic here at all. Poisoned? Yes, but it isn't lethal (in small doses) towards your passion. A few 1-stars, a drop in views, or the lacking in feedback are not going to kill you. I, personally, don't like the rating system in general, but it is by far the better of some I've come across (try writing a story on TGStorytime and discover that anyone can repeatedly rate the same chapter, not just the whole story, but each chapter and repeatedly without end until the story is at a star rating they desire. That rating system there is garbage).

Speaking of TGStorytime, let's talk again about the most popular problem with mostly everybody here: smut. Sex sells and a lot of authors are fully aware of the attraction. Those who don't want to pander towards that genre are pissed about all the attention it received and still comes. That won't stop. What are they to do about it? How about this: why do you care? What is it about that attention that is some bothersome? Exposure. The other authors lack it.

That is a first tell sign that the salty authors (yes, salty, because you're crying about it) are not writing because it's fun anymore to write; they also want recognition for their work. Work? Work. You're not having fun now. You're, as I said earlier, salty because of what writing has become for you. You're frustrated at apparently not doing something right, upset that there isn't enough attention directed your way, and angry at all of those who have figured out what the consumer desires.

This is now work for those authors. Each chapter has become a job for who knows how long they can keep the creative juices flowing. If they don't pull in enough of what they want, they cut their losses and drop it. It's simply business now.

I don't like it. No one should care if I do. I'm just a single digit to your views.

Let me help some of you though. Okay? Okay.

For those who can't figure out how to grab more attention: advertise. Go to different platforms (other websites) and expose yourself there. Be sure to remember to link everybody back to where you want them to go. Spammers do it all the time and, guess what, they're still in business because of it. Despite all of the people who get angry about the spam (like you are with smut), they still are grabbing those silent viewers to watch their peep show. Expose yourself more and more people will look your way. Simple as that.

For those who can't figure out how to git-gud: practice. Practice, practice, and practice. As someone I once knew had said: "Know your stuff before trying to write about it and proofread the absolute crap out of your work until you're sick enough of it that ya can vomit the thing word for word." Keep it up. You will improve and you eventually will have a gratifying amount of comments sent your way on how well you've done it.

The best selling authors are not the best writers; they're the best sellers of their work.

 

[ForestDweller]

This whole thread is bullshit. I avoid those threads involving discussion posts discussing the trending tab and ones concerning 1-stars because I just get disgusted with everyone in them. Seems I have to avoid these sorts too.

Then go. Why are you still posting here there?

And I'm still seeing entitled bitching. Woe is me I'm not the prettiest pony in the field anymore!! Woe is me!! They don't recognize my greatness!! Woe is me!! Still one of the most popular writers here...and still crying. Are you sure your adult enough to be here? Greedy too?

Grow up or stop writing. Thank you.

Yea, this is an entitled bitching thread. Don't like it? Then leave.

 

[CL]

Then go. Why are you still posting here there?

I believe (just guessing here) that message was directed towards me.

 

[Tessa_Renalds]

I can say from experience writing 3-5K worded chapters do not increase your readers, comments, or likes. Just write the amount that fulfills what you‘re trying to accomplish in that chapter. Quality over quantity.
Am I worried about it, nah not really. I enjoy what I write and my best friend enjoys what I write.

Now if only I followed that same advice to not write such lengthy chapters... could save myself some struggles...

 

[LostLibrarian]

I wouldn't go as far and say "looking at stats is like work" or the like. Hobby and looking towards success aren't mutually exclusive. If you have hobby bands, they'll practice for their gig. If you look at runners, they'll try and better their personal bests and compete in races. And so on and so forth.

If you invest a lot of your time into a hobby, you also want to see some results. That's natural. And the problem with writing is that most results are fairly subjective or non-obvious. "Better usage of adverbs" isn't something you can really qualifiy, "500 readers milestone" is.


It's normal - especially in the early days - to look towards numbers and affirmation that the time is not wasted or that the growth is really there. It's okay to be down about numbers, it's also okay to drop stories if the numbers are horrible, but the important thing is: there'll always be a wall at some point. And you'll have to keep going and break down that wall eventually.

It's like people who go on a diet and don't see a daily change in the mirror (because they are so small each day), but other people realize it right away when they see you after a month. Today's chapter might not be visible better than yesterday's, but when you keep going, last year's might just be an entire level below.


So it's good to look at numbers from time to time, because those numbers also can be a form of feedback or validation. But you shouldn't forget that you as writer are growing alongside your story...

 

[ForestDweller]

I wouldn't go as far and say "looking at stats is like work" or the like. Hobby and looking towards success aren't mutually exclusive. If you have hobby bands, they'll practice for their gig. If you look at runners, they'll try and better their personal bests and compete in races. And so on and so forth.

If you invest a lot of your time into a hobby, you also want to see some results. That's natural. And the problem with writing is that most results are fairly subjective or non-obvious. "Better usage of adverbs" isn't something you can really qualifiy, "500 readers milestone" is.


It's normal - especially in the early days - to look towards numbers and affirmation that the time is not wasted or that the growth is really there. It's okay to be down about numbers, it's also okay to drop stories if the numbers are horrible, but the important thing is: there'll always be a wall at some point. And you'll have to keep going and break down that wall eventually.

It's like people who go on a diet and don't see a daily change in the mirror (because they are so small each day), but other people realize it right away when they see you after a month. Today's chapter might not be visible better than yesterday's, but when you keep going, last year's might just be an entire level below.


So it's good to look at numbers from time to time, because those numbers also can be a form of feedback or validation. But you shouldn't forget that you as writer are growing alongside your story...

I'm not sure if I'm growing to be honest. Just the last day, a reader brought up significant problems in my writing, something I should've learned to overcome before I wrote half a million words.

 

[EternalSunset0]

I'm not sure if I'm growing to be honest. Just the last day, a reader brought up significant problems in my writing, something I should've learned to overcome before I wrote half a million words.

Tbh this is one of the reasons I feel feedback is so important. While I do think that we can learn by practicing, I think that blindly "just writing" or "just practicing" will let a person's skills plateau sooner than later. Eventually, people have to work smart instead of hard and that's where the engagement comes in.

Sorry if that kinda deviated from the topic on-hand, but I just felt like I needed to chime in a bit. Concrete suggestions on what you could do is a lot more helpful than just doing your thing and finding out some fundamental errors that should have been addressed 300k words before.

 

[LostLibrarian]

I'm not sure if I'm growing to be honest. Just the last day, a reader brought up significant problems in my writing, something I should've learned to overcome before I wrote half a million words.

There are two things to writing: The writing and the editing/planning. Especially for webnovels you have a subset of writers who just go with their muse and just write whatever they can think of. This might work for some, but overall it is really important to concentrate on both states.

I personally believe, that the second part (editing/planning) is more important, because that'll make or break your story more than a missed adjective or a typo. Act-structure, hero's journey, etc... those are things that can help you grow in that regard. There are also some podcasts who go with that specific topic.


So making a chapter flow better, write a more natural description, characters or dialogue. Those are things that'll get better bit by bit "on its own" (as long as you write with the will to evolve). But story/scene structure or the like might be something you just have to work on in addition to your writing.

That said, what was the big flaw? There might be some things that can point her development toward the right direction...

 

[ForestDweller]

That said, what was the big flaw? There might be some things that can point her development toward the right direction...

Vocabulary
Pacing
Character Motivation/Development

 

[Devils.Advocate]

Change the story's direction rapidly? Give a better synopsis and cover page? Or just halt writing until you can figure out the problem?

Hmm... "view count" and "readers" the increase and decrease extrude different meaning for different people, for some, it could mean the quality of work, others its a loophole in the SEO, on another corner it the fuel for a person's confidence and self-esteem; and on another still, its a very tangible metric of monetary gain.

I am just wondering @ForestDweller what does "view count" mean to you?

It'd be easier to say how to deal with it if we are both on the same page of what needs fixing.

If view count means quality to you, it will be seeing if writing style needs changing or analysis on your writer's craft

if view count means motivation/self-esteem/fame. seek more manageable @Motivation for writing or get some in-depth introspective soul searching. on how to deal with it.

if view count means a job/monetary gain, seek SEO option, advertising, just pragmatic solutions for efficiency, regurgitate know popular tropes and copy and paste ideas that you know works, and manipulate the system to your advantage.

There are more solutions than there are grains of sand on the beach, but none of them will fit unless we know what the question really is.

I.E

View count means __________________ to me. It is decreasing, this means I am getting less _____________________ how do I fix this?

 

[ForestDweller]

if view count means motivation/self-esteem/fame. seek more manageable @Motivation for writing or get some in-depth introspective soul searching. on how to deal with it.

Mostly this, to be honest.

There's no point in writing when you don't have an audience. I can just keep my story in my head, without wasting hundreds of hours trying to put it down in paper. I'm not the type that likes to read my own writing.

Or participate in a collaborative writing instead, like an RP, where you have a guaranteed response from the other guy. A shame no RPs ever get finished.

 

[CL]

Mostly this, to be honest.

There's no point in writing when you don't have an audience. I can just keep my story in my head, without wasting hundreds of hours trying to put it down in paper. I'm not the type that likes to read my own writing.

Or participate in a collaborative writing instead, like an RP, where you have a guaranteed response from the other guy. A shame no RPs ever get finished.

Dreaming is a sweet escape. I know that very well.

 

[LostLibrarian]

Vocabulary
Pacing
Character Motivation/Development

I would say that all three belong more to the editing/planning part of writing. vocabulary is something you can slowly build up while reading yourself or trying out thesaurus or something like that. If you use a word too often during one chapter, try looking for a similar one to break the repetition. That said, there is no real need to go and learn vocabulary on its own. Rather try reading other stories, which'll might also give you a feeling for pacing or characters.

Pacing and characters are a big part of story/scene planning. So you might look into something like arc-structure or scene types together with shifts for your story. If you roughly plan out your arc like a 3-act-structure, you'll have to give roles to your different characters, which will inform their motivation for their actions. To complete the arc, you'll need certain things happen, which gives you a list of scenes that have to happen, with each scene achieving one or multiple things. These scenes then can be your chapters, which makes pacing the chapters easier, because you have a clear goal in mind.


I started something about that, but it became a bit too long, so I turned it into its own thread instead of page 4 of a thread many authors won't read. Here it is:

How to: use story theory to plan arcs

So I started writing the part below for another thread as an example on how planning stories with act-structure and story theory can help with pascing and character development and motivations. This is a really basic example with a story, that took probably 15 minutes thinking up while writing...

forum.scribblehub.com

I personally always try to use story theory as much as possible, when I create the first draft for my stories/arcs. Even if you later break rules, it's good to know the rules first. And using constraints and rules really helped me to achieve better pacing, clear climax-scenes, and ideas for future character development...

So look at it. I personally think, it's always helpful to look into such things. One hour spent on story theory might help you grow more than 10 weeks of writing without clear goal or idea...

 

[Devils.Advocate]

There's no point in writing when you don't have an audience. I can just keep my story in my head, without wasting hundreds of hours trying to put it down in paper. I'm not the type that likes to read my own writing.

Fair enough, first you have to decide what amount of readership/view count is the justifiable number for the 100s of hours of writing. Realistically speaking, all stories will slow down eventually. Since the number of readers is limited in the community.

If you are unable to negotiate what amount is reasonable for your story, but only feel that the "high" provided from the increasing view count is no longer able to motivate you. I would suggest ending a series and starting a new one. Improving SEO and improving writing skill, might give the new series more longevity and reach higher before the plateaus since the initial momentum and timing does play a role in a story gaining a following.

Changing the current series' SEO might make a resurgence in view count, but improving the material by changing direction will unlikely to make any significant changes. And will risk losing readers you already have. Since at this moment, the quality and the story's ending is not your priority but instead the view count.

If just for a bump, you might want to commission a new cover to the novel. write a one-shot and like back to the main story. Since the content is there, its just a matter of PR. Trying to write better, is just a side gig.

And honestly, "quality" is not the main deciding factor of view counts. "quality" is the main deciding factor for writers that see their work as more than just a tool but it means something to them artistically. So I'd say don't worry about writing better at all, just work the system, get that view counts.

Thus I'd say no matter how true @LostLibrarian 's advice on improving a story is, it not advisable to work towards an ending. In your case anyway. You should not be looking for a complete story but instead, work toward something that could endlessly turn out view counts like it is a singular purpose. The sooner the story ends, all the potential view counts will be lost, you need to milk every idea dry.

Now that I think about it, I'd go as far as to say. just keep going, jump the shark and keep going, shorten chapters and make 3 releases instead of one. Eventually, the length and number of chapter alone will attract enough google keyword searching A.I to provide you with all the view count SEO you'd ever need.

I hope this helps.

 

[ForestDweller]

How do you improve SEO? I only know that you want to get your story to trending as much as you could for that visibility.