What makes a hatable villain?

[BubbleC]

There's a story idea I have about a villainess (I mean an actually terrible person) who gets a second chance in life. But, I'm not entirely sure what horrendous things she would have to do to be someone who could be considered 'evil.'

So, I look to the forums for help.

What traits make someone practically irredeemable? Who are the best worst villains that just make your blood boil, and what have they done? And ultimately, what is it that makes you hate someone/a character (not talking about plot holes or bad writing, but a well-written terrible person)?

 

[witch_sorrowful]

A very good villain does something for a reason. Horrible things - mostly related to snuffing out another human's (or whatever species, point is, living things) life. But, the most horrible feeling that a reader can have is sympathy for evil.

Okay, let's clarify - there are three primary emotions you can feel for "evil" - Horror, Disgust, and Awe.

Horror evil is found in Stephen King's books. Like, the eponymous 'It' from It. It keeps on killing people - nothing much else. It is a thing that most adults can't grasp, only visible to some children. It is tugging at primal ancient fear of children - who find monsters under beds. Is it a hatable villain? Oh certainly, but it is also a villain to be very, very afraid of. You hate its coming on to the page.

Disgust is like Thanos. He has done an awful thing, but can you feel sympathy for his cause? Sure. And that disgusts the audience and tells them that even their morals can be bent. Or Voldemort as to what he does in Harry Potter. He keeps killing, and hates people, and is a not so subtle reference to the Nazis.

The last one is Awe, but that's the sort of "evil" without knowing what it does is evil - the Lovecraftian Horror. The Dark One, from the Wheel of Time, the Joker from Batman all fall in this (the Joker is fundamentally a twisted individual whose plans create horror, but also dazzle you with what he will do. You cannot help but feel awe at him). Feeling awe at something doing fundamentally evil things again creates this tension within the reader.

So this is what makes, to me, a compelling villain in a story.

When it comes to completely hateable and hateful characters, you could select any of the archetypes. Such villains no longer sound compelling, but as a villainess who is a protag, you probably want something more compelling than completely irredeemable.

Also, fiction is very forgiving. Is killing Children irredeemable? Well, SPOILERS, but Anakin Skywalker goes to Jedi Heaven in Episode VI. So, I dunno. What do you find irredeemable?

 

[Agentt]

Bullying is classic
Scribble on books
Pour water over school bag or the person
Add laxative in food and lock the toilet door
Spread rumours
Make them fall


Or if you wanna go real dark route
Murder the pets
Break hymen using a , idk, knife?
Post nudes online
Add drugs
Or well, not a villian but a hero who makes my blood boil. The MC of School Days.
Get yourself a girlfriend who loves you dearly, discover that you are in love with another girl and date her too. Don't break up with first girl since she has boobs.

Then proceed to cheat both of them by f*cking 20 strangers

 

[AliceShiki]

Characters are usually only hatable if they're poorly written or if they're plain assholes.

Like, Voldemort is hatable because he is defined by a single word... Racist.
That's a poorly written character, he has no depth at all, so you hate him because he is defined by a characteristic people in general dislike.

Other hatable characters are the bullies that harrassed the main character before the MC became OP and stomped them all... You hate them because they're assholes that exist just to beat up the MC, and once they serve their purpose, they disappear from the story altogether.

I don't think anything you put in your main character will make the readers treat said character as evil. For as long as you can see the thought process behind the character, you'll probably be able to understand their motivations even if you don't agree with them.

 

[witch_sorrowful]

Like, Voldemort is hatable because he is defined by a single word... Racist.

Voldemort, if anything, is a very well written character. And that one word doesn't describe him completely - he has ambition driven to the extreme, he seeks control over everything, even mortality. Racism is a subset of Voldemort, and his intrigue in the first five books was about his search of power, and a growing dread of things going wrong. So, I'm sorry to disagree with your analysis, Voldemort is one of the best villains in modern fantasy. Better than Sauron, in fact.


Also, waits a full Academic Year for Harry to complete his studies.

 

[BubbleC]

Also, fiction is very forgiving. Is killing Children irredeemable? Well, SPOILERS, but Anakin Skywalker goes to Jedi Heaven in Episode VI. So, I dunno. What do you find irredeemable?

Well, I say irredeemable but I don't plan on making the character irredeemable. The whole story is about redemption, after all.

I just want to get a gist of what people consider irredeemable (from an outsider's perspective) to help form the conflicts and perspectives of the surrounding characters. The whole story is supposed to examine what we find to be evil from the eyes of the evildoer. I just find a lot of villainess/villain redo stories don't push the protagonist to be evil enough (they're just misunderstood or there's another two-faced villain that slanders them).

I suppose to a degree the concept is supposed to be like Koe no Katachi or other redemption stories.

 

[witch_sorrowful]

I just find a lot of villainess/villain redo stories don't push the protagonist to be evil enough (they're just misunderstood or there's another two-faced villain that slanders them).

I suppose, handling remorse is very difficult (American History X does it brilliantly) in stories. I think it will be better to be honest and write about what you feel is irredeemable to yourself.

I for one, find betrayal of oaths, the slavery of humans, denial of identity almost as bad as rape and murder. The poisoning of one's mind by whispers of someone else is also horrible. Cruelty towards animals.

 

[COLOC_Kid]

inability to criticize themselves in addition to loving to focus on their good deeds while blaming others for their most heinous acts.

me I hav dignity and honor i will tell you i'm a intelligent ant that wants vengeance and it's my choice alone.

 

[Icanica]

There's a story idea I have about a villainess (I mean an actually terrible person) who gets a second chance in life. But, I'm not entirely sure what horrendous things she would have to do to be someone who could be considered 'evil.'

So, I look to the forums for help.

What traits make someone practically irredeemable? Who are the best worst villains that just make your blood boil, and what have they done? And ultimately, what is it that makes you hate someone/a character (not talking about plot holes or bad writing, but a well-written terrible person)?

I think that the isms can apply to make someone an evil person. Racism, sexism, classism (hatred against the poorer classes for example). People who pass racist policies aren't just dumb, they're oftentimes master manipulators. Like even though Hitler hated the Jews for a variety of stupid reasons, he used his hatred of them to create a scapegoat in Germany while the people were suffering under the burden of their war reparations. Then he parlayed that scapegoat into a fascist autocracy which collected money from the poor classes and gave it to the rich, him included.

I definitely hate the characters that make light of human suffering and inflict it upon others without thinking about the consequences. For example, characters who make fun of you for living in poverty, for a death in your family, etc. Although Sakura from Naruto only did it once in the first two episodes of Naruto, it was

Traitorous cowards as well are more insidious kinds of villains. They could act on your side but when the moment of truth comes, they abandon you for their own safety but not just with no remorse but with some remorse as if they've decided that their happiness is more important than your own and have come to that realization.

People who defile human dignity are people I would hate. Like what Jeffrey Epstein did to his victims, like colonizers who visited brothels in the countries they imperialized, like the cult in Eyes Wide Shut. Pedophiles, rapists, creepy stalkers, race fetishists, certain types of sadists (there are good more innocent sadist tropes).

People who take advantage of weakness. The twitter killer for example, who saw people in Japan with suicidal thoughts and murdered and dismembered them when some of them asked to be killed. He could parlay his crimes into something more innocent because the victims asked for it but he ended up dismembering them and some who changed their minds, he still killed.

 

[COLOC_Kid]

I think that the isms can apply to make someone an evil person. Racism, sexism, classism (hatred against the poorer classes for example). People who pass racist policies aren't just dumb, they're oftentimes master manipulators. Like even though Hitler hated the Jews for a variety of stupid reasons, he used his hatred of them to create a scapegoat in Germany while the people were suffering under the burden of their war reparations. Then he parlayed that scapegoat into a fascist autocracy which collected money from the poor classes and gave it to the rich, him included.

I definitely hate the characters that make light of human suffering and inflict it upon others without thinking about the consequences. For example, characters who make fun of you for living in poverty, for a death in your family, etc. Although Sakura from Naruto only did it once in the first two episodes of Naruto, it was

Traitorous cowards as well are more insidious kinds of villains. They could act on your side but when the moment of truth comes, they abandon you for their own safety but not just with no remorse but with some remorse as if they've decided that their happiness is more important than your own and have come to that realization.

People who defile human dignity are people I would hate. Like what Jeffrey Epstein did to his victims, like colonizers who visited brothels in the countries they imperialized, like the cult in Eyes Wide Shut. Pedophiles, rapists, creepy stalkers, race fetishists, certain types of sadists (there are good more innocent sadist tropes).

People who take advantage of weakness. The twitter killer for example, who saw people in Japan with suicidal thoughts and murdered and dismembered them when some of them asked to be killed. He could parlay his crimes into something more innocent because the victims asked for it but he ended up dismembering them and some who changed their minds, he still killed.

they don't deserve life.

 

[atgongumerki]

if you want others to hate someone, give them something they don't deserve.
have them be smug about it, and give them more things they do not deserve.
then have them take credit for other people's work, and thus gain more things they do not deserve.

 

[Gastic]

There's a story idea I have about a villainess (I mean an actually terrible person) who gets a second chance in life. But, I'm not entirely sure what horrendous things she would have to do to be someone who could be considered 'evil.'

So, I look to the forums for help.

What traits make someone practically irredeemable? Who are the best worst villains that just make your blood boil, and what have they done? And ultimately, what is it that makes you hate someone/a character (not talking about plot holes or bad writing, but a well-written terrible person)?

I guess when they find the line of what they consider wrong, and they cross it without the intent to turn around. Reveling in the harming of others.

 

[owotrucked]

Characters are usually only hatable if they're poorly written or if they're plain assholes.

Like, Voldemort is hatable because he is defined by a single word... Racist.
That's a poorly written character, he has no depth at all, so you hate him because he is defined by a characteristic people in general dislike.

Other hatable characters are the bullies that harrassed the main character before the MC became OP and stomped them all... You hate them because they're assholes that exist just to beat up the MC, and once they serve their purpose, they disappear from the story altogether.

I don't think anything you put in your main character will make the readers treat said character as evil. For as long as you can see the thought process behind the character, you'll probably be able to understand their motivations even if you don't agree with them.

I thought there was a phenomenon where people liked villains when they were too exaggerated because people couldnt recognize themselves in the caricature. So that provided psychological relief.

On the opposite, people hated villains that reflected their own selves. So I thought the most hatable villains would be normal people who would pick the evil/selfish choices for relatable reasons.

With this logic, I'd guess that the most hatable villains might be the heroes who falls from grace that the readers got attached to in the beginning of a story.


Cardboard bully doesnt make me feel much but maybe thats just me

 

[WasatchWind]

If there is a common theme I see in great villains, it is ones that personally hurt the hero. It is a very counterintuitive thing when a non lethal attack against one of our favorite characters can feel worse than reading "and the bad guy killed ten thousand innocent people" - but I haven't seen much of a counter example.

The reason for this is, we have grown so attached to these characters we've followed. We have become invested in their struggles, their goals, everything about them. When something gets in their way, we feel frustration. When they are brutally hurt by someone in a personal way, it feels extremely horrible.

That is one of the things that makes a villain feel all the more vicious. There are things like making them a bad a** warrior, or ruthlessly cunning - but adding that personal touch will make them all the more horrible.

One example that comes to mind of how to craft such a moment is from the original Star Wars trilogy. Luke's most dominant trait is a loyalty to protect his friends, to the point that he can often foolishly jump into dangerous situations. After the reveal that Darth Vader is his father, Luke is extremely strained, but he feels, in his naivete, that he can save his father.

But then there is the moment, where Luke begins to let his anger flow, and Darth Vader sees his thoughts - "your sister... your own thoughts have betrayed you. If you will not join me, maybe she will..." The moment sparks intense rage in Luke to the point where he nearly kills his father.

The moment has impact for multiple reasons. Luke has struggled to hone his abilities in the force. In that moment, his discipline failed. He tried to protect his friends - they are dying in an almost futile battle, and now Luke fears for his sister's well being too. Capping this off, it seems like he has given up - his father is too evil, he is past saving.

Of course, Luke has a moment of clarity following this, and shows mercy - but you may very well choose not to do that. The lesson to learn is how to build up to that moment where the villain seems to fracture the very soul of our MC or someone they care about.

 

[IvyVeritas]

I have multiple villains in my story. Some are pretty much a mystery at this point, but the one that everyone really hates is the one who's a villain for the most human of reasons.

Everyone's the hero of their own story; no one believes they're the bad guy.

The villain that the readers hate in my story is actually fighting against the other villains. He believes he's doing the right thing, and sometimes he is. Unfortunately, he's also a narcissist. He's ambitious and desires power, but he doesn't have the patience, the intelligence, or the compassion to wield that power appropriately.

And so he makes bad decisions without thought or care, forcing people to obey his will because that's easier than doing the right thing. The crimes that he commits are the crimes that we see every day in the news, perpetrated by otherwise normal people.

I think what makes readers hate the character is the contrast between acting as if he's the hero while also doing horrible things.

(While I was writing this, owotrucked wrote something similar. People are uncomfortable if they recognize their own flaws in a villain.)

 

[OvidLemma]

One of the best ways to make a villain hateable isn't about the horrible things they've done. Sure, a villain needs to do horrible things. But a mindless, bloodthirsty creature also does horrible things, which is just in its nature. Beyond just doing evil, the villains that provoke real emotional responses from readers are ones that manipulate social situations in ways that enrage the readers. For instance:
1) A hateable villain might make up bald-faced lies to paint the heroes in a bad light (and make themselves look good). While we know what actually happened, the villain is able to paint a different scenario that people who weren't there at the time cannot differentiate from the truth. Thus, the villain is "stealing" social goodwill at the expense of the heroes.
2) A hateable villain is able to manipulate otherwise good or neutral people. They turn people against the heroes. They take advantage of corrupt social institutions (e.g. get corrupt cops to persecute innocent people or heroes). They remain legally untouchable while making things harder for the heroes out of sheer shittiness.
3) Above all, a truly face-punchable villain gets satisfaction out of these things. We, the readers, see them satisfied, but they hide that satisfaction whenever they aren't rubbing it in.

In short, setting your villain up as a master social manipulator who breaks social rules while getting away with it (or even praised for it) is a great way to make that villain not just a danger, but one who you genuinely hate.

I generally don't make my villains like this - I usually go for morally gray villains whose goals happen to go against those of the heroes. But the few times I have (e.g. Erasmus Moody in Transfusion), readers really responded to it and had a visceral angry response to the villainous shenanigans.

I have multiple villains in my story. Some are pretty much a mystery at this point, but the one that everyone really hates is the one who's a villain for the most human of reasons.

Everyone's the hero of their own story; no one believes they're the bad guy.

The villain that the readers hate in my story is actually fighting against the other villains. He believes he's doing the right thing, and sometimes he is. Unfortunately, he's also a narcissist. He's ambitious and desires power, but he doesn't have the patience, the intelligence, or the compassion to wield that power appropriately.

And so he makes bad decisions without thought or care, forcing people to obey his will because that's easier than doing the right thing. The crimes that he commits are the crimes that we see every day in the news, perpetrated by otherwise normal people.

I think what makes readers hate the character is the contrast between acting as if he's the hero while also doing horrible things.

(While I was writing this, owotrucked wrote something similar. People are uncomfortable if they recognize their own flaws in a villain.)

@IvyVeritas Your villain (Prince Rusol, I believe his name is?) is a good example of the sort of villain I mentioned above. His unique set of powers controls otherwise-unwilling people and masks his villainy from others. He has the perfect skillset to escape detection and prosecution while doing absolutely horrible things to people, and getting to see that in action is what makes him so face-punchable. He's a good villain because his glaring personality flaws and massive moral lapses are smoothed over by cheat powers that he in no way deserves.

 

[Deleted member 45782]

There's a story idea I have about a villainess (I mean an actually terrible person) who gets a second chance in life. But, I'm not entirely sure what horrendous things she would have to do to be someone who could be considered 'evil.'

So, I look to the forums for help.

What traits make someone practically irredeemable? Who are the best worst villains that just make your blood boil, and what have they done? And ultimately, what is it that makes you hate someone/a character (not talking about plot holes or bad writing, but a well-written terrible person)?

A hatable villain is the one that gets away with doing a lot bad things or damages so much that it takes years to recover or heal from. This is both in fiction and in real life.

For a well written terrible person? Maybe start with how they may have been a likeable character once but slowly they descent into madness or something.

Or just describing in detail the horrendous things they do to make the readers really seethe and want the villain fall to demise.

Villains that are evil but somewhat resonate with some traits of others may not get so hated. Sometimes villains in certain stories are more fleshed out with certain things that make people go wonder y'know if they hadnt gone this extreme route or something they may actually have a point. Thanos is a villain and everyone knows he is one, but if you see some people comments, they sorta feel like thanos did had a point, but the way he did is so extreme and horrific, inflicting the suffering of those who lost many of their friends and loved ones when he snapped in the mcu universe. Villains twist things to a really extreme end that doesn't care to trample on others for the sake of their goals or ambitions.

Also evil but not truly evil, or didnt start out evil sometimes make those sympathize more. Like for example, ghost stories movies. Idk some just seem tragic and that takes away the horror of the story, bc at the end of day its things that led them to become this way, so it doesn't feel as much evil rather than just pity.

But seriously villains that are truly disgusting and evil are the ones that get away with doing so much shit and don't care bout other lives. They trample on peoples lives and the worst thing is they can manipulate so many to their cause to continue harming others under a certain pretense. And often times these villains don't die/punished in a satisfying way for all the things they have done like it sometimes it feels like they had easier death than all the deaths/destruction they have caused. They are really detestable.

If you write a really detestable villain character, it would be describing all the horrendous things they did in detail. Not trying to show what other side they're like or justify their wrongdoings, cause then people don't see the other side to them or how they come to be this way, they just see how cruel they are and feel like that is all to them. And it really make them all the more hateful.

 

[DubstheDuke]

NTR

 

[Deleted member 53101]

NTR

This is utterly wrong ..., cuz there's someone out there who actually loves to be netorared, to be netorased, to be netoried. It has become quite a fetish for somehow or another.

There's actually a story built up by the whole premise of 'I want to ntr my friends' girlfriend.' And there's also a story with the MC being so miserable and weak-willed pussy that he got netorared by his best bud. A villain who steals the wife of others is not that hateable nowadays ..., though, I admit I can't stand such conduct. It's disgusteng.


When I designed a villain, I try to find the positive side of my protagonist and find the opposite from that. They'll clash ... and surely that one character will infuriate me the most, even when I'm the one who wrote him down.

The protagonist of my story is a freedom-seeker, responsibility-shirker, a jerk who loves to fuck play around and never really care much about anything aside from that. So what's his villain? Okay, find the opposite of the protagonist trait ..., if he's a freedom seeker then the villain will be an order mania. Mc love to shirk on his duty, then he's a man of duty. MC loves to fuck around, the villain is a stern and serious dude who never put the word 'play' on his vocabulary.

Yeah ..., if it's like that, seems like the MC is more a villain than the villain himself.

 

[IvyVeritas]

@IvyVeritas Your villain (Prince Rusol, I believe his name is?) is a good example of the sort of villain I mentioned above. His unique set of powers controls otherwise-unwilling people and masks his villainy from others. He has the perfect skillset to escape detection and prosecution while doing absolutely horrible things to people, and getting to see that in action is what makes him so face-punchable. He's a good villain because his glaring personality flaws and massive moral lapses are smoothed over by cheat powers that he in no way deserves.

Yes, Prince Rusol is the one I'm referring to. He's also a bit of a tragic figure, in that he could have been a good person. His father, King Marten, isn't particularly good or evil, but he's a very good king who's always looking out for the kingdom's interest (sometimes to the detriment of their neighbors). Rusol's brother Rikard was well loved by both commoners and nobles alike. Rusol believes he's following in their footsteps, but he's not. There are a number of scenes where he's obviously trying to do the right thing, and the readers may start to identify with him, but then he hits them with a reminder of why they hated him in the first place. That might be another contributing factor to why readers hate him so much.