Transgender tag

[gaylolis]

I'm really confused on how should I use the tag.

They're quite prevalent in gender-bender stories, especially the MtF ones.

Most of my inspiration came from Anime, so I wasn't well informed on these things.

What's the difference between it and gender benders that aren't transgender?

Does it have to do with the main character's desire to be a girl in the first place, or the transformation process itself? whether it's a magical transformation, or something like hormone therapy?

Let's say my character was a guy who wanted to be a cute girl, so she could yuri other girls, and get magically turned to a girl one day. does that make her a transgender? or it matters more on what gender she identifies with?

like, when she thought of herself as a yuri girl in the first place. or whether it didn't matter, or still thought of herself as a guy, before accepting her yuri girl persona?

I'm kinda scared to check out the transgender stories myself, for some unknown reason. so I hope you folks can help me out.

 

[TLCsDestiny]

I'd say gender bender is outside change, trans is inside and body. ???

 

[PrincessFelicie]

...Out of curiosity what makes you scared of looking at the transgender tag?

(Also your questions are... hard to answer, because you seem to be drawing an arbitrary line between a lot of various things that would or would not fall under transgender based on interpretation and further context.)

 

[gaylolis]

...Out of curiosity what makes you scared of looking at the transgender tag?

(Also your questions are... hard to answer, because you seem to be drawing an arbitrary line between a lot of various things that would or would not fall under transgender based on interpretation and further context.)

a lot of them seems too western and unfamiliar for me, and i'm especially get turned off by MtF pairings with men.

i did get traumatized by western novels in the past since a lot of them are hard to read, and they seem to tried their best to spam hard vocabularies and overly long sentences than telling a meaningful story, and i hate them to their guts.

i also hate how their stories are cluttered in a single, large wall of text instead of several paragraphs and sentences.

im kind of biased towards eastern-themed stories, especially the anime novels. probably since the translated ones so far used simple language, and i prefer easily readable ones.

 

[Suzumiya]

I'm really confused on how should I use the tag.

They're quite prevalent in gender-bender stories, especially the MtF ones.

Most of my inspiration came from Anime, so I wasn't well informed on these things.

What's the difference between it and gender benders that aren't transgender?

Does it have to do with the main character's desire to be a girl in the first place, or the transformation process itself? whether it's a magical transformation, or something like hormone therapy?

Let's say my character was a guy who wanted to be a cute girl, so she could yuri other girls, and get magically turned to a girl one day. does that make her a transgender? or it matters more on what gender she identifies with?

like, when she thought of herself as a yuri girl in the first place. or whether it didn't matter, or still thought of herself as a guy, before accepting her yuri girl persona?

I'm kinda scared to check out the transgender stories myself, for some unknown reason. so I hope you folks can help me out.

I'd say the "Transgender" tag should be considered to include the same things as the term does in popular psychological diagnostic manuals. That is, literally all non-binary gender.

If an additional tag comes around such as 'Gender Bender', I would be confused.

 

[PrincessFelicie]

fwiw the transgender tag gb novels I've read don't have the complicated language you complain about, as far as I'm aware.

 

[Daitengu]

"Let's say my character was a guy who wanted to be a cute girl, so she could yuri other girls, and get magically turned to a girl one day. does that make her a transgender? or it matters more on what gender she identifies with?

like, when she thought of herself as a yuri girl in the first place. or whether it didn't matter, or still thought of herself as a guy, before accepting her yuri girl persona?"

I would consider that trans. A person wishing to be another gender and changes gender is trans. A person who was forced to change gender from an outside force regardless of will is gender bender.

So yeah, one is internal, while the other is external.

Gender dysphoria is a bitch, and I find most gender bender stories ignore it all together. I mean, why even have gb if you aren't even going to explore it's effects on the MC. Just start as a girl.

Know what I haven't seen in isekai? A sad sap wishing to be the opposite gender to the god/goddess. It's always a forced gender swap.

 

[PrincessFelicie]

as for when the transgender tag is applicable, it's if the character's personal gender identity doesn't match the sex they were assigned at birth. And trans women can in fact be lesbians. So your yuri character, whether to tag transgender or not? Depends if they see themselves as a girl or not, or eventually come to after character growth.

 

[Sabruness]

Summon @QuietValerie who is probably one of the best people on SH to talk about transgender vs just genderbender.

i can understand OP's concerns though. Thats why i just stick to writing pure yuri (shabby though my storytelling may be)

 

[K5Rakitan]

From what I understand, in gender bender stories, the protagonist still identifies with the sex assigned to them at birth.

Your yuri girl example sounds trans to me. In fact, she sounds a lot like my best friend, who was my boyfriend in high school. When she was still exploring and opening up about her desire to transition, she said, "I'll be the biggest lesbian ever!"

Still, I recommend talking to actual trans people if you can.

Recommended reading: “Tree Black” by Connor de Bruler

 

[A.P.R.L.]

I'd say pretty much the same everyone else said. My college boyfriend for example was a FtM transgender and he always told me that he didn't feel any dysphoria until he reached puberty and actually realized how uncomfortable he felt with his female body. Even joked sometimes he missed being "a lesbian" but that in the end he was always meant to be a straight guy.

The main difference between gender bender and transgender stories would be that with transgender, the character feels like their new sex aligns better with their perception of themselves. So, even if it was a forced genderbending if the character ends up feeling more comfortable or liking their new sex better while not feeling like going back to their previous sex, then I'd say, yes, it is transgender. On the other hand, on simple gender bender stories, the character still feels identified with the sex they were assigned at birth.

 

[YuriDoggo]

So ideally, properly tagged, all [Gender Bender] stories that end up with the character in question identifying as their new gender are [Transgender], right?

Actually, I tend to avoid the [Transgender] tag since i interpret it as going into the nitty gritty of dysphoria and aftermath, which I'm not looking for when I'm reading novels on SH (easy wish fulfillment, basically). There's plenty of other novels if I wanted that.

 

[gaylolis]

So ideally, properly tagged, all [Gender Bender] stories that end up with the character in question identifying as their new gender are [Transgender], right?

Actually, I tend to avoid the [Transgender] tag since i interpret it as going into the nitty gritty of dysphoria and aftermath, which I'm not looking for when I'm reading novels on SH (easy wish fulfillment, basically). There's plenty of other novels if I wanted that.

yeah, it's one of my pet peeve as well.

i don't wish to go for some hard drama which made me feel unpleasant, but more on comfort and fluff :D

 

[Feather]

I had a conversation like this not long ago, so sorry if I butt into the conversation.

Gender Bender is basically anything that has to do with gender/sex change. This can be magical or sci-fi.
Transgender is generally a subgenre of gender bender, where sexuality and pre-change identity and dysphoria plays along, however, it does not necessitate actual biological sex change.

Since Transgenderism is getting a popular (as a story subject) and people who write webnovels don't bother to properly tag their novels this got confusing as people unfamiliar with it learned to use it in the wrong way. It's the same with manga, jap novels, where gender bender/trap/crossdress/tomgirl (edit: and probably many other words I don't know) are often used interchangeably even though they all mean completely different things.

EDIT: plus since the transgender tag is almost as popular a the gender bender tag, this makes it all seem to have even less sense.
EDIT: in conclusion, both can be used individually or even at once.

 

[DekuKurohi]

Honestly speaking I have been confused about what the hell transgender is for a longest time (ironic considering I'm Thai) until I start reading on here and tgstroytime.

People on this thread already explained it pretty well so I'll keep it short.
Transgender: Those whose gender identity does not match their birth/physical gender (Big difference there) and therefore desire change to be the gender they want to be.
Gender Bender: Much simpler than transgender to explain, literal change in the person's physical body that alter their gender through some (Surgery and hormone, magic, crazy sci fi stuff pick your poison)

If you read a lot of Japanese stuff you probably aren't aware of such a concept since Japan for whatever reason is very insensitive/oblivious to it, very few gender bender stories addressed the big elephant (or lack thereof) in the room regarding the change aside from "Haha he/she became a female/male that's funny/hot"
I know a lot of them doesn't go far beyond that because I painstakingly tried to find all I can and watch/read them because it's my fetish, and those that do address transgender as well either doesn't have it as a main focus so that tends to fall under the radar, maybe it's lost via adaptation or translation.

I can't really say anything about western gender bender and/or transgender stories because I never focus on them.

Side note: Use cis to refer to those who aren't trans and trans for... trans.

 

[GDLiZy]

Transgender: physical change (generally through surgery)

Gender Bender: something about distorted gender (gender swap, crossdressing, or anything like that)

 

[AshlynGoodman]

Gender bender is, as the name suggests, a switch between genders. That’s all.
Transgender is a far more complicated matter. The character was originally born of one sex but would prefer to be of the other. Not necessarily from birth, but may realise their desire later in life, though they usually experience gender dysphoria throughout their lives until their transition (although transition isn’t a pre-requisite to be trans). Transgenderism is entirely biological in nature and cannot be changed with nurture. In my case I didn’t realise I was trans nor notice I was experiencing gender dysphoria until I began experiencing gender euphoria when I had gender affirming experiences.
Tldr; don’t fecking put transgender in the tags unless the character has some innate desire to be of the opposite sex or experience some gender dysphoria/euphoria.

 

[The_LivingLegend]

When I think of gender bender I think a person who is cool with who they are but then suddendly are turned into the other sex because magic.
When I think of transgender I think a person who always felt like they were supposed to be the other sex, and then change due to magic/surgery.
In other words, just people who are changed to the other sex but still feel like their original one is gender bender, but people who are changed to the other sex and then start feeling comfortable with their new selves is transgender (also includes people who always felt that they were born as the wrong sex).
Of course this is just my opinion and the difference between the two doesnt really matter on this site because almost every transgender novel is just a dude turning into a girl because fantasy and magic which then turns into girls love, yuri, and smut.

 

[Skadia]

In other words, just people who are changed to the other sex but still feel like their original one is gender bender, but people who are changed to the other sex and then start feeling comfortable with their new selves is transgender (also includes people who always felt that they were born as the wrong sex).

I agree with that, though I'd add that oftentime Gender Bender stories tend to just shrug off the whole "identity" thing. People will just suddenly switch gender and go on with their lives like the change wasn't that impactful. They'll also sometimes be referred to by new pronouns, or just "get used to it" at some point. I'd say that we often don't know what the genderbent character identifies as afterwards, because it's not adressed.

Of course this is just my opinion and the difference between the two doesnt really matter on this site because almost every transgender novel is just a dude turning into a girl because fantasy and magic which then turns into girls love, yuri, and smut.

This I disagree with. The transgender tag is filled with stories with characters for whom the change is a really important one, be it identity-wise or plot-wise, or both. Obviously some stories in there don't fit this criteria, but they are there because people tagged their stories incorrectly. Most of the things you can find in the top 50 transgender stories are tagged correctly, though.

 

[Moonpearl]

Transgender and GB are separate things, but they can be combined.

The transgender tag just means that a story has characters that are transgender. There's no need for any sort of transformation, or even for them to have started transitioning, if that's something they'll end up doing. It's the character's state of being, just like a "bisexual protagonist" tag works even if your character isn't dating multiple people throughout your story.
If you're not familiar with trans people, there's a kind of okay beginner's explanation here: https://www.livescience.com/54949-transgender-definition.html

Gender bender tends to be about people having their sex magically changed to something that doesn't "suit" their gender, and then being forced to be viewed as the gender typically associated with that body and live out that gender role.

However, if you combine it with the transgender tag, the person might well prefer their new body because the gender associated with it is the gender they are, so... It's a different sort of story, most of the time.

Also, transgender people are real, but gender bender isn't really. Not the way we tend to use it.