Cultivating

[Discount_Blade]

So, let me start this by saying I hate Xianxia. They almost always follow a similar premise and its typically a shitty one at that. Once you've read one, you've most likely read them all. Even the ones people say are cool tend to be shit. Sovereign of the Three Realms was supposed "the coolness"....but no it sucked too. It was a carbon copy of countless others. People also say the ones by I Eat Plants is good but....no. He's one of the worst offenders in my eyes. The only ones I haven't attempted that people are raving about is Coiling Dragon and Against The Gods, but I'm concerned about trying because I just don't think I'm a fan of the genre. I don't think I CAN be satisfied with it, even good ones.

Also, I can't find Coiling Dragon anywhere that isn't trying to sell it instead. WuxiaWorld removed it from free to read and is now selling it on Amazon and NU's version is mostly WuxiaWorld links so oh well. I was too late.

It might just be me, and not the genre itself. There is another one people raved about but I honestly can't remember it. Something to do with Black Powder or something. Black Powder Empire or Gun Powder Empire? Idk I can't remember the name. Maybe one of you guys know what I'm talking about.

Anyway, my point here is to mention that my distaste for Xianxia is ironic seeing as the thing I've been working on in the background, that after a little over a month of plotting it out, it's starting to resemble a cultivation novel. Not in the most specific sense, but it's starting to resemble it in certain aspects. Meditation is a thing. Clans are a thing. Not sects though, I've never really liked that word. Sect. I've also started plotting potential wars and am running into the same problems Xianxia does. You can't have a war if one person is strong enough to bring the smackdown on an entire army alone. That was one thing that always irritated the piss out of me about Xianxia wars. It was never a war. Just one guy flexing his muscles and cutting thousands down at a time.

It's just ironic is all. Oh well. It's going to start slow paced anyway. 13k words down so far.

Really ironic that I genre I've insulted constantly, (which I'm now concluding it might also be me personally not liking and not just the genre having problems) is kind of taking over my behind-the-scenes thing.

 

[GDLiZy]

Xianxia genre is a potential wasted. The setting itself is so all-encompassing which great mechanic that can become a staple setting like tolkien fantasy, if not for the braindead plot and reoccurring events the authors used.

Aside from that, I have one complaint: why isn't xianxia a genre in SH yet?

 

[ForestDweller]

I've also started plotting potential wars and am running into the same problems Xianxia does. You can't have a war if one person is strong enough to bring the smackdown on an entire army alone

Isn't that the same of western fantasy as well?

 

[Discount_Blade]

Isn't that the same of western fantasy as well?

Not really. Most western fantasies don't feature extremely OP MC's. And if they do suddenly become extremely OP, its normally near the end of the story.

 

[Owl]

So you've taken something you don't like and are reworking into something you do like. Sounds like a nice thing?

 

[Discount_Blade]

Xianxia genre is a potential wasted. The setting itself is so all-encompassing which great mechanic that can become a staple setting like tolkien fantasy, if not for the braindead plot and reoccurring events the authors used.

Aside from that, I have one complaint: why isn't xianxia a genre in SH yet?

Likely was chased off or 1-starred to oblivion and we know how emotional people get with a single 1-star.

I know one by a dude named Linodo. I have to admit, I really hated his at first. It ended up being 14-15 books long, and the 1st book was just sooo bad....but then amazingly, he made it awesome. Book 2 was still shaky but from book 3 and on....idk but he really improved. Amazingly so. I have to say he really shattered my earlier preconceptions. Kudos to Linodo. I left a less than peasant review on his. I apologized later after I finished reading it after giving it a second try. I hope dude forgave me.

He's working on something else now that I'm waiting for it to build up on chapters before I begin it.

 

[Discount_Blade]

So you've taken something you don't like and are reworking into something you do like. Sounds like a nice thing?

Not sure. I honestly hadn't consciously noticed I was doing it until I started looking over my notes a day or two ago. Caught me by surprise.

 

[ForestDweller]

Not really. Most western fantasies don't feature extremely OP MC's. And if they do suddenly become extremely OP, its normally near the end of the story.

I mean Japanese western fantasy.

 

[Discount_Blade]

I mean Japanese western fantasy.

Ah, yeah thats a whole different ball game. But I still wouldn't call it actual western since it's western with an eastern mindset. And I'm pretty much done with most JP stuff. Their typical brand of MC's have begun to disgust me. And I abhor tsundere's and apparently in a lot of JP work, if the plots failing, toss another fucking tsundere in is an actual strategy. I also avoid Shounen like the plague because their "heroes" are always unrealistic. Needless to say, Naruto broke me. Last shounen. Ever.

 

[K5Rakitan]

Meh. We all have different tastes. Don't torture yourself if you're not into it.

 

[SailusGebel]

First of all, you are mixing up different terms. Wuxia, Xuanhuan, and Xianxia. I may be wrong here as well. But if I'm not wrong, Sovereign of the Three Realms, Coiling Dragon, and Against The Gods are all Xuanhuan. And this genre implies a more heavy usage of fantasy and so on. Xianxia is much less epic and grand than Xuanhuan. Once again, I may be wrong here but, in Xianxia, there won't be immortals here and there destroying planets and stuff like that. There will be the same ideas though, going through every novel. I've read Against The Gods, it's a Xuanhuan, and it's absolutely the same as all the other ones. It's arguably written a little bit better than others, still, the core of the story doesn't change. You can try and read Wuxia stories. They are less fantasy, if you read manhwa Breaker, you should have a general idea of what is Wuxia.

About wars, usually, it is balanced with other strong dudes or things like magical arrays. If you have trouble in your story you can try an implement it. A magical array is a thing that allows a mob to combine their magic, chi, qi, whatever word you want to use, and defeat a stronger enemy.

A part of the problem is that it's a Chinese story, written for Chinese. I mean, probably Chinese like that kind of story, even if it's the same thing over and over again. They like the references to their history and culture. You should also remind yourself that most of those writers are on a paycheck. They don't have enough time to develop the story and don't have enough time to read something new to gain new and fresh ideas. After all most of them aren't professional writers, they simply want to write their own version of what they liked. Combine it with a fact that they should write a chapter a day to stay relevant, and that's why almost all of them end up in a repetitive hell. Where all the arcs are the same. I also think that some of them are tied to a story so deeply that they can't end it. Because it is their lifeline, they can't just end a story after a thousand chapters, because it means they would start losing money, from qidian. And when they can't end a story, they eventually ran out of ideas and it develops into a mess of a repetitive and forced plot.

 

[Discount_Blade]

First of all, you are mixing up different terms. Wuxia, Xuanhuan, and Xianxia. I may be wrong here as well. But if I'm not wrong, Sovereign of the Three Realms, Coiling Dragon, and Against The Gods are all Xuanhuan. And this genre implies a more heavy usage of fantasy and so on. Xianxia is much less epic and grand than Xuanhuan. Once again, I may be wrong here but, in Xianxia, there won't be immortals here and there destroying planets and stuff like that. There will be the same ideas though, going through every novel. I've read Against The Gods, it's a Xuanhuan, and it's absolutely the same as all the other ones. It's arguably written a little bit better than others, still, the core of the story doesn't change. You can try and read Wuxia stories. They are less fantasy, if you read manhwa Breaker, you should have a general idea of what is Wuxia.

About wars, usually, it is balanced with other strong dudes or things like magical arrays. If you have trouble in your story you can try an implement it. A magical array is a thing that allows a mob to combine their magic, chi, qi, whatever word you want to use, and defeat a stronger enemy.

A part of the problem is that it's a Chinese story, written for Chinese. I mean, probably Chinese like that kind of story, even if it's the same thing over and over again. They like the references to their history and culture. You should also remind yourself that most of those writers are on a paycheck. They don't have enough time to develop the story and don't have enough time to read something new to gain new and fresh ideas. After all most of them aren't professional writers, they simply want to write their own version of what they liked. Combine it with a fact that they should write a chapter a day to stay relevant, and that's why almost all of them end up in a repetitive hell. Where all the arcs are the same. I also think that some of them are tied to a story so deeply that they can't end it. Because it is their lifeline, they can't just end a story after a thousand chapters, because it means they would start losing money, from qidian. And when they can't end a story, they eventually ran out of ideas and it develops into a mess of a repetitive and forced plot.

Xianxia is the one with all the magic and breaking worlds. Xuanhuan is the less magical one. Also....dude Breaker is fucking awesome. Really bummed out that creators took a hiatus on it to focus on their other work. Which isn't as good in my opinion even though I love the history period its based on.

 

[NotaNuffian]

So, let me start this by saying I hate Xianxia. They almost always follow a similar premise and its typically a shitty one at that. Once you've read one, you've most likely read them all. Even the ones people say are cool tend to be shit. Sovereign of the Three Realms was supposed "the coolness"....but no it sucked too. It was a carbon copy of countless others. People also say the ones by I Eat Plants is good but....no. He's one of the worst offenders in my eyes. The only ones I haven't attempted that people are raving about is Coiling Dragon and Against The Gods, but I'm concerned about trying because I just don't think I'm a fan of the genre. I don't think I CAN be satisfied with it, even good ones.

Also, I can't find Coiling Dragon anywhere that isn't trying to sell it instead. WuxiaWorld removed it from free to read and is now selling it on Amazon and NU's version is mostly WuxiaWorld links so oh well. I was too late.

It might just be me, and not the genre itself. There is another one people raved about but I honestly can't remember it. Something to do with Black Powder or something. Black Powder Empire or Gun Powder Empire? Idk I can't remember the name. Maybe one of you guys know what I'm talking about.

Anyway, my point here is to mention that my distaste for Xianxia is ironic seeing as the thing I've been working on in the background, that after a little over a month of plotting it out, it's starting to resemble a cultivation novel. Not in the most specific sense, but it's starting to resemble it in certain aspects. Meditation is a thing. Clans are a thing. Not sects though, I've never really liked that word. Sect. I've also started plotting potential wars and am running into the same problems Xianxia does. You can't have a war if one person is strong enough to bring the smackdown on an entire army alone. That was one thing that always irritated the piss out of me about Xianxia wars. It was never a war. Just one guy flexing his muscles and cutting thousands down at a time.

It's just ironic is all. Oh well. It's going to start slow paced anyway. 13k words down so far.

Really ironic that I genre I've insulted constantly, (which I'm now concluding it might also be me personally not liking and not just the genre having problems) is kind of taking over my behind-the-scenes thing.

Err, Xianxia to me had always been a power fantasy to me, like seriously, the author is not even going to lie and just plot armor his MC to kingdom come and make him the most OP bastard in the realm. Then go to the next realm and do it all over again.

For me, I no longer read xianxia for the plot, because it is a wish fulfilment story, in most xianxias I read, I would just off my brain and soak in the "feel good I am a literal God bow at me" feel. I just read them for their BS mechanics and maybe cool sounding techniques and stuff.

Indeed, the story is no brainer, nothing worth to remember, because the authors churn words for V Bucks.

 

[Silver_Sky]

I've also started plotting potential wars and am running into the same problems Xianxia does. You can't have a war if one person is strong enough to bring the smackdown on an entire army alone. That was one thing that always irritated the piss out of me about Xianxia wars. It was never a war. Just one guy flexing his muscles and cutting thousands down at a time.

With this problem you could have the main character be a major tilt factor to the war, have the other side suffer a loss or two but going forward have a major returning enemy and have mc tied up away from affecting the war and you can finally have your mc give a fitting end to the enemy. This gives you a way to make the war go your way like having MCs side lose or win. You could even introduce a new pain in the...... I mean a 'rival' yeaaahh that. If you introduce this kinda character you can force a losing altercation for mc as well as progression and inability to engage in the war as you were worried about.
Basically make a character that can match mc or forces mc away from the war. If you write in a romance the love interest(s) can lead the war force/resistance.

 

[Jemini]

Xianxia is a specific sub-genre within the cultivation-style story telling. It has specific plot points that need to be filled in order to be considered Xianxia, and those specific points are so limiting it just about completely kills any and all creativity.

Wuxia are a little better. They also use cultivation systems, but they theoretically possess a lot more freedom to the story telling. Essentially, a wuxia is any Chinese-written cultivation novel that does not conform to the incredibly limiting plot structure necessary to be considered Xianxia. However, a lot of wuxia authors do not seem comfortable with straying too far from the Xianxia format. They just deviate in some small way, but fall to the same issues in the long run.

What you REALLY want to look at are western-written cultivation novels. Western writers did not come into writing within a culture filled with these strictly formatted stories. As such, those western writers tend to just regard cultivation as a power system and are plenty capable of using it without bogging themselves down with those restrictive plotting structures.

I can link my 2 favorite western-written cultivation novels, but be warned that one of them has gone up on amazon and thus took down their chapters from Scribble Hub.

Dungeon Mage

The world is a Dungeon. The Dungeon Core shattered long years ago in an event called the Splintering. The shards of the Core scattered across the world. The large ones formed mini Dungeons of their own. The smaller ones turned into Skill Shards. The inhabitants of the world can fuse...

www.scribblehub.com

System Programmer

After dying, our main character found himself summoned by a young woman. She comes from a long line of summoners and had expected to partner up with a powerful being, like the rest of her family. Instead, she summoned a computer programmer, who from now on will be living inside...

www.scribblehub.com

 

[Jemini]

Face-palm.

How could I possibly forget the single biggest western-written cultivation novel in all of web-novels!? Yeah, if this thing doesn't convince you the western-written style is excellent at realizing the potential of cultivation as a power-system, almost nothing will.

He Who Fights With Monsters

Access the discord here: https://discord.gg/CDV5SqM Book 10 starts with chapter 699. Earlier books available on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08WF8SB71 Jason wakes up in a mysterious world of magic and monsters. He’ll face off against cannibals, cultists, wizards, monsters, and...

www.scribblehub.com

 

[NotaNuffian]

Face-palm.

How could I possibly forget the single biggest western-written cultivation novel in all of web-novels!? Yeah, if this thing doesn't convince you the western-written style is excellent at realizing the potential of cultivation as a power-system, almost nothing will.

He Who Fights With Monsters

Access the discord here: https://discord.gg/CDV5SqM Book 10 starts with chapter 699. Earlier books available on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08WF8SB71 Jason wakes up in a mysterious world of magic and monsters. He’ll face off against cannibals, cultists, wizards, monsters, and...

www.scribblehub.com

@Jemini I cannot judge the other two works because I have not read them before, but for He Who Fights With Monster as a xianxia work, yup, that is stretching it.

So the cultivation/ using some methods to attain a higher form of existence/ grinding and leveling is used here as a link in terms of xianxia is creative. But unfortunately that is the only thing (other than arrogant young master trope) that loosely ties it into the genre. Mostly I just see the work as LitRPG, not even a system (gold finger) genre.

 

[TLCsDestiny]

The idea of cultivation is huge and probably is used in many novels, without you even realizing it, so if you can find a way to like the genre...that might be easier lol.

I made up my own and am proud of it.
No 'normal person' is an uber, godly person and you can't learn everything.
I cut it into 2 lots, personal and skill and personal is basically your 5 senses, which you only improve. (Personal is also what everyone can do)
Skill, which is basically mental, physical, spiritial, etc is something you can come up with yourself!
If you don't want a story that has mind control, or whatever, don't put it in. (In my story, everyone had 1 skill, it was rare if someone had more)

A more detailed explanation of my idea on this concept of cultivation is in a chapter of the Anonym & Switch story of mine.
Look up the meaning of cultivation and instead of hating the idea of it, make your own idea of it up. It's your story.
Honestly, any type of learning or acquiring a skill is cultivating so you'll probably have it whether you like it or not...

 

[Discount_Blade]

Face-palm.

How could I possibly forget the single biggest western-written cultivation novel in all of web-novels!? Yeah, if this thing doesn't convince you the western-written style is excellent at realizing the potential of cultivation as a power-system, almost nothing will.

He Who Fights With Monsters

Access the discord here: https://discord.gg/CDV5SqM Book 10 starts with chapter 699. Earlier books available on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08WF8SB71 Jason wakes up in a mysterious world of magic and monsters. He’ll face off against cannibals, cultists, wizards, monsters, and...

www.scribblehub.com

Nope hate it. Got sick of his complete insert of politics and religious opinions. If I wanted to read about how "woke" and "Atheist" an MC is, I'd just drink bleach instead and wash it down with a shot of windex. MC's like him are why, if aliens exist, they are staying far the fuck away from humanity. As they should. Cuz there are so many entitled woke bitches just like him literally dirtying up the planet's limited oxygen supply. The story would be good if someone managed to crush his windpipe so he couldn't talk. Actually no, not even then. We'd still have to read his rants which might be even worse than his dialogue.

Maybe if he died and a more sufferable MC took over? Dunno.

 

[MarkofWisdom]

Coiling Dragon is ok, but nothing special really. Though I suppose that makes it better than some other series that are simply awful. The units used late in the series get especially ridiculous-everyone at that point that isn't dead is immortal so time is meaningless, but the author goes to hilarious lengths like them riding a train in the afterlife equivalent for *decades* in order to go on a single mission for some group. Then there is some once in a bazillion years proxy turf war thing in some separate dimension-all well and good except it lasts for like....10000 years and various factions are fighting constantly the entire time. The silly distances, power levels and other things are all there, but the decades/centuries long train ride for a single mission always stood out as exceptionally strange.

Sovereign of the Three realms was ok at first but loses coherency after a while, it seems like a pattern that the first world/segment is the best one and most well thought out, and that anywhere after that is just little blips of info/story in an unfathomably vast cosmos where basically nothing matters anymore

Avoid Against the Gods like the plague unless you can stomach an outright psychopath hypocrite for an MC. The MC there is one of the *worst* characters I've ever read about that (probably) wasn't intended to be hated by everyone. The comedy in the early arcs was decent and the MC had to be clever rather than just bash everyone's face in, but once the power levels started spiking it all fell apart in a hurry.

The one man nuke/army type deal in Xianxia is a recurring theme, and it's very frequent that enemy factions will only attack when the big beat stick of another faction is out of commission or away, leading to silly things like who can meditate the fastest/best and reach the next power level to be a better beat stick than their enemies.

Side note-agreed, tsundere are awful. There are a few decent ones that manage to find a balance that is tolerable, but most of them are exaggerated abusers and toxic