You don't ask for permission when writing fanfiction.
Just apply to the other side too: "You don't ask for permission when using a picture for your story."
And you don't mention the name of authors, editors, helpers, etc. But, apparently, it's not rude. OK.
1. The author is being credited, just as the artist is getting credited.
2. You don't credit the editors helper etc. and that is fine, they have "nothing" to do with this. If I hire someone on Fiverr to make something for me I don't credit them either. Once they are done with their job they have nothing to do with that piece. Credit to the owners of the property.
I'm not mixing anything, and I have no bias. I don't see any difference at all. Why writing fanfic is okay, but using a picture from the internet is not okay? What's the difference between using others' intellectual property and borrowing a picture? I can't see it. On both occasions, you use other peoples' labor.
This is pretty much cause of all the confusion. You approach this issue from the "Using one thing makes using everything okay" side while I approach this issue from the "You don't use xxx so don't use anything" side. My issue with your approach is that you force false equality on all property but ignore what rights the real property owners have.
But this whole issue is not black/white anyway so a simple way doesn't work. Whatever.
We have a picture an artist made. He has no right to monetize it because it's a fanart or some other circumstances.
Yes. But he owns it.
You take it and credit him.
Shitty but that's how it is.
You don't steal money from him.
Still theft.
In fact, if you strike it big, you can contribute to this artist's popularity.
"I'll pay you with exposure"
Still theft.
Yes, he spent time drawing. So did an author who spent time writing a story you 'borrowed' to write your fanfic.
He spent time drawing it and he owns it. You simply stole it.
He spent time writing it and he owns it. You make a transformative peice and you own your piece. Not all contents though. But you still own what you wrote.
And you can't monetize your fanfic.
Yes. No money for fanfic writer.
It's fanfic, so the borrowed picture doesn't contribute to you in any way.
Irrelevant whether it contributes to you or not. It's theft.
It can contribute to your popularity, yet the big words: A NARUTO FANFIC, contributes to your story no less.
Yes. But the amount of contribution is still irrelevant.
Actually, we don't have a statistic on what contributes more, but it doesn't matter.
Yes.
I think you're referring to photomanipulation. Like this.
I'd say this isn't enough of a transformation to make it yours. Just adding a title isn't either. This much + a title isn't enough either.
I thought it was obvious that you would change the pic you took in one way or another. Cause you need a cover, not a simple pic. You will at least slap your title on it. So, technically, you add\change something.
See above.
The problem is that you cut a piece of what they said out of its context. The next line they wrote negated the part you quoted. As an example, "Is it alright to put milk in the bowl before the cereal? I disagree." You quoted the first part while leaving out the second.
I read it again, but I feel like it's really about how you intrepret what he said. I've addressed it again here.
The way I interpreted it at least, made it seem like they were saying that fanart, fanfic, art theft, and stealing a story are all the same. That's something I can agree with. It's just that for some reason, people agree that it's okay to do the first two. A bias. They add qualifiers like, 'if you credit the original maker' and 'as long as you don't make money off it'.
I'm repeating myself because this is a huge ass post now. But I want to be as clear as possible on this one.
Fanart and fanfic have great amounts of transformation. That is why they are okay.
copy pasting something is theft. No credit in the world makes that okay and I don't understand why people think crediting someone gives you the right to steal. The reason fanart and fanfics are okay is not because of crediting the owner but because of the transformation that you add.
But that doesn't change what it is. 'If they were a really bad person, it's okay to murder them.' It's still murder, though. Obviously, this isn't as serious as murder. In fact, even if you catch someone stealing a picture off google, or posting another author's work unmodified, you won't be able to do anything about it.
I think this is a very bad comparison.
I've seen hundreds of people selling their fanart, having fanfictions as a reward for Patreon, taking random pictures off google and changing the lighting a little to make it 'theirs', and of course, Webnovel's little shadow sites. It's all equally wrong, but there's nothing you can do about it.
Yeah that's shitty. But in my experience, at least the stalls with printed items, arent the artists but art thefts. Ive often seen stalls with artworks from friends of mine (obviously without their permission) being sold on big conventions (I mean E3 level big). But yeah not much you can do about shit like that.
Fanfic and fanart, by common agreement, are 'allowed with qualifiers'. And a lot of people enjoy making and consuming them. But it's hypocritical to pretend that it's somehow not stealing. You are relying on someone else's work, almost ALWAYS without permission, to boost your own position.
I didn't want to leave this single paragphar alone when I quoted everything else in this thread lol Already talked about this, nothing to add.
…can’t we just appreciate the art instead of starting a discussion about another topic?
NO! It's nice art though.
