Is all this just a waste of time?

[Tessa_Renalds]

I also like to point out some prolific authors didn’t catch a break until their mid thirties to forties. Sometimes you don’t succeed on the first, second, third or fifteenth try. It takes time and effort.
*edited

 

[someguysomeone]

Seriously don't make writing your carrer. Do BSc become a teacher. A man should live his life based on idealism and make decision based on cold rationalism and pragmatism.

Personally i don't even write the book i just daydream and write some of it. If i am in it for my own pleasure then what's the point trying to make it useful or enjoyable for others.

 

[Deleted member 54065]

We all get to have our own 'poison' to take. For others, it's drinking alcohol and drowning their sorrows with it.

For us, it's writing.

And yes, don't make writing your career. Publishing nowadays is highly competitive and treacherous. Instead, treat it as a hobby that could be successful, or not. In any case, at least you've written what you want to write.

 

[Tessa_Renalds]

We all get to have our own 'poison' to take. For others, it's drinking alcohol and drowning their sorrows with it.

For us, it's writing.

And yes, don't make writing your career. Publishing nowadays is highly competitive and treacherous. Instead, treat it as a hobby that could be successful, or not. In any case, at least you've written what you want to write.

It’s good to see you back Hans!

 

[Deleted member 54065]

It’s good to see you back Hans!

Had to use a VPN just to be able to get back 'safely'.

 

[WasatchWind]

Think of it like f2p games- switch to f2p actually makes MORE money to the industry, it's just more continous and less front loaded.

Most popular writers on RR and SH make over 10k$ a month including amazon book sales. Though it depends on your model and marketing skills. If you want to feed family by writing you are unlikely to succeed, period - in one of his lectures Brandon Sanderson talked about how, when he graduated from fancy university with writing degree, out of his class where all people tried to become writers full time, only something like 20% succeeded. And that was super high. And before the self-publishing days. Path of art is always hard.

And don't misunderstand it as me saying that printed books suck or anything, or as hate towards publishers, but man, if you believed it was ever easy to earn money writing or even remotely likely, you are naive. Even famous authors had to earn money in other ways for years before becoming successfull writers- Hunter S Thompson, D. F. Wallace, Hemmingway - they had to be reporters, and/or write short technical stuff. People who send novels to big publishing houses and got accepted, and magically became able to earn money by writing are exceptions of exceptions.

You also seem to think that serialising novels is somehow less, shit ton of famous novels (and respected) were serials.. just serialised in literary magazines that sold books chapter by chapter. "I Robot", (many early asimov works actually?), I think many works by Lovecraft, or with traditional literature for example Lalka (noble prize winning, sorry if you don't know it but it's super big deal in my country :P)

Video on publishing:

I never thought it would be easy, or that I wanted it to support all of my income - I just wanted the effort of writing to be able to offset the time I spent working on it.

And those authors that you mentioned that were serialized were serialized in magazines and newspapers. I don't think that scribblehub is lesser or anything, but I don't see someone examining scribblehub years from now and going - oh my gosh, this man's book HAS to have an edition in print!

It's not going to happen. I just wanted the feeling of being able to hold my work in my hands... of being able to see that tons of people were reading it, and have some validation that I wasn't just some weird guy making stories that were clones of Sanderson's work.

But I'm feeling like that reality is splashing me in the face too. I am just a Sanderson copy cat, my work won't be successful, and I doubt I'm even going to finish my first draft.

 

[Arkus86]

I have seen several authors get published with both prited books and e-books, and only taking their novel off off sites like RR and SH after they secured a deal, or even only taking down the published books of a novel, save some preview chapters, and continuing to post new chapters for free online until those get published as well, so it's certainly possible.

Examples I remember are This Quest is Bullshit, Dungeon Heart and Deck of Souls.

 

[WasatchWind]

Seriously don't make writing your carrer. Do BSc become a teacher. A man should live his life based on idealism and make decision based on cold rationalism and pragmatism.

I was planning on getting some career with my generic digital media career. I would never become a teacher. I don't have authority to speak on anything, and I've been around the kids that my dad, a junior high woodshop teacher, had to deal with. School is becoming hell for teachers in the United States. I'm just glad my dad is retiring in a few years because it decreases the likelihood of some stupid kid's parents trying to cancel my dad because he said something they didn't like.

And yes, don't make writing your career. Publishing nowadays is highly competitive and treacherous. Instead, treat it as a hobby that could be successful, or not. In any case, at least you've written what you want to write.

I've said it to the other comments here, I'll say it again. I never wanted to make writing my full career - but I wanted something to justify the time spent on it. I doubt that I will get even that.

For others, they just enjoy the passion of writing. For me, the passion comes from seeing that I was able to give people something they enjoyed. I don't know whether that's arrogant or just lusting after fame.

When I don't get anyone validating that my work isn't literal garbage, it gives me little motivation to write. It takes on the same cast that all my other creative pursuits take. You barely do more than trace others' work with your drawing. Your guitar playing is barely pleasant to listen to. The games you've made are made in a children's programming language and aren't even fun.

Yet for some reason I torture myself. I tell myself that somehow my work will have a positive impact on the world. And still I continue to roll this boulder up a hill, knowing that it will never amount to anything.

I have seen several authors get published with both prited books and e-books, and only taking their novel off off sites like RR and SH after they secured a deal, or even only taking down the published books of a novel, save some preview chapters, and continuing to post new chapters for free online until those get published as well, so it's certainly possible.

Examples I remember are This Quest is Bullshit, Dungeon Heart and Deck of Souls.

But the big western companies, that is, the ones I'd be submitting my story to, don't stand for that. If I want to get my story to its actual mainstream audience, then it's either play by their rules, or have a crappy little google doc that one or two people think is nice and I feel is utter garbage.

 

[Deleted member 54065]

But I'm feeling like that reality is splashing me in the face too. I am just a Sanderson copy cat, my work won't be successful, and I doubt I'm even going to finish my first draft.

Well, if you know you're copying Sanderson, then try to make your own road by 'learning' from Sanderson and applying your own style to your work.

Second, you're too young to say that your work wouldn't be successful. Rowling was 40+ years old when her work got noticed, and tons of rejections too. Prolly some professional editors also told her that her Harry Potter idea was shit too. Fitzgerald was already dead when his work got noticed and became a standard read in American education system.

Now then, as I've said, literature is highly-competitive. It's pretty discouraging to see your work (hard work) amount to nothing, but nevertheless, would you give up because some professionals tell you it's not worth it? Feel sad, or depressed for the meantime. Heck, leave your pen and notebook, or any writing instrument for a while. But if writing's what you really want to do, go back to it. (Trust me, with my tags: harem, non-smut isekai, the discouragement is great.)

My bottom line is, DON'T LET OTHERS SAY THAT YOU CAN'T DO IT.

 

[Jamminrabbit]

Is this just a rant or are you genuinely asking for help?

 

[ArcadiaBlade]

I'll be honest with you. I am you if you had given up on everything. My results are always bad but for you, you are luckier than I was when I don't have good fortune such as you.

Hell, the more I read into your thread, the more I realize that you are basically me but heading the same path as me. Hopeless and giving up on everything.

As a person who whose also a writer as well, I can honestly tell you that whatever path you choose, please pick a path that is right and not be like me. Giving up on the dreams I once had.

Having passion to draw but no talent whatsoever, going to college and learn how hard it is to even make a game from scratch, now, I also gave up on writing due to how unpopular I was until realizing that I was actually good at writing but too unmotivated to do my best.

Yeah, your path and mine are connected and even you are actually heading to my path to pain and suffering as well. But you still have hope, someone still believes you can do it and its your own choice of the matter but for my sake and yours, don't be like me. Don't give up until the end, Just think of the times how writing is fun and how you still didn't end up like me. A guy who tried his best but no one to rely or lean into.

 

[Kuropon]

First, how much money do you wish to make with your writing? Because you can earn a lot with Patreon and Amazon but you'd probably have to limit yourself to some genres.

If you really just want to earn money you will probably be unable to write exactly what you want but will have to look into it with a more reader mindset. 'What would the readers want.' 'What a twist can I put in to have the readers stay interested.' ect.

 

[WasatchWind]

Is this just a rant or are you genuinely asking for help?

I don't know. I don't think anyone has anything way to offer me help. If I had a way to get a real opinion from someone in publishing on what to do, that would help me.
But I have no idea how to do that. If I was ballsy I'd email Brandon Sanderson, as he has his contact info out there for readers. That feels tantamount though to writing a letter to Santa Claus at my age and expecting an actual result.

First, how much money do you wish to make with your writing? Because you can earn a lot with Patreon and Amazon but you'd probably have to limit yourself to some genres.

If you really just want to earn money you will probably be unable to write exactly what you want but will have to look into it with a more reader mindset. 'What would the readers want.' 'What a twist can I put in to have the readers stay interested.' ect.

I want to make enough money to offset the opportunity cost of writing. I don't think that I can be successful in that if I think I can just open up a patreon.

That requires having a fanbase, and I definitely don't have that. I cannot see in a million years why someone would pay to read my unedited work, especially if I was just going to post it on one of these sites later.

 

[Kuropon]

I want to make enough money to offset the opportunity cost of writing. I don't think that I can be successful in that if I think I can just open up a patreon.

That requires having a fanbase, and I definitely don't have that. I cannot see in a million years why someone would pay to read my unedited work, especially if I was just going to post it on one of these sites later.

Yeah, but how much a month is that? I have a larger Patreon than most and people read my barely edited webnovels. You can start with that, see how it goes then use that as a springboard for amazon and publish there.

Then maybe, if you can show the numbers of your sales to a publisher they could pick you up. Not sure if you would even want that depending on how much you are earning.

 

[EternalSunset0]

Had to use a VPN just to be able to get back 'safely'.

Yo, what happened, if I may? It's fine if it's too private or what, but I am also staying in the Philippines now, so it might be of concern.

I never thought it would be easy, or that I wanted it to support all of my income - I just wanted the effort of writing to be able to offset the time I spent working on it.

And those authors that you mentioned that were serialized were serialized in magazines and newspapers. I don't think that scribblehub is lesser or anything, but I don't see someone examining scribblehub years from now and going - oh my gosh, this man's book HAS to have an edition in print!

It's not going to happen. I just wanted the feeling of being able to hold my work in my hands... of being able to see that tons of people were reading it, and have some validation that I wasn't just some weird guy making stories that were clones of Sanderson's work.

But I'm feeling like that reality is splashing me in the face too. I am just a Sanderson copy cat, my work won't be successful, and I doubt I'm even going to finish my first draft.

I don't blame you lol. I think everyone wants validation or at least a quantifiable proof that they mean anything in the grand scheme of the world or the community. Even if we can't be the protagonists, we at least want to be that named NPC that people know for a niche and can go to for certain things if you get my drift. But as you said in a further reply, I can't really do much to help you because we likely have different perspectives and personalities (like most people), and even if I had a kinda degree on psychology, I'm admittedly a terrible people person. I can probably tell you what's causing all those troubles, but I'm terrible at solving them for you. Most I can do is to show that you're not alone, I guess.

If there's any suggestion I can give, maybe you can try self-publishing if you got the money? And I don't mean self-publishing for the sake of selling books en masse. Literally just self-publish a copy of your book (once you're done editing and almost perfecting it to satisfactory levels) and have it sit on your shelf. Have it serve as a trophy or a proof that you did something worthwhile. That you took the first step and at least tried something productive. You can maybe then share it to your friends or someone if you can find someone who you think can appreciate your work.

I crave validation as much as you do, but I think for me, it mostly comes down to contentment in terms of numbers. I want them, but I can tell myself that I don't need huge numbers, just a few sincere comments and feedback would do. If someone would read my works from start to finish and give me a single thanks or find a waifu out of it, I'll probably be on cloud nine. Then I drown myself in imagining my series as an anime lol. And learning how to draw better so that I can soon pretend I have those lewd magazine pin-ups you see in Megami (just Google Megami pinup and other weeby terms if you're not familiar with them).

 

[Wohendum-Bluu]

Think of it like f2p games- switch to f2p actually makes MORE money to the industry, it's just more continous and less front loaded.

Most popular writers on RR and SH make over 10k$ a month including amazon book sales. Though it depends on your model and marketing skills. If you want to feed family by writing you are unlikely to succeed, period - in one of his lectures Brandon Sanderson talked about how, when he graduated from fancy university with writing degree, out of his class where all people tried to become writers full time, only something like 20% succeeded. And that was super high. And before the self-publishing days. Path of art is always hard.

And don't misunderstand it as me saying that printed books suck or anything, or as hate towards publishers, but man, if you believed it was ever easy to earn money writing or even remotely likely, you are naive. Even famous authors had to earn money in other ways for years before becoming successfull writers- Hunter S Thompson, D. F. Wallace, Hemmingway - they had to be reporters, and/or write short technical stuff. People who send novels to big publishing houses and got accepted, and magically became able to earn money by writing are exceptions of exceptions.

You also seem to think that serialising novels is somehow less, shit ton of famous novels (and respected) were serials.. just serialised in literary magazines that sold books chapter by chapter. "I Robot", (many early asimov works actually?), I think many works by Lovecraft, or with traditional literature for example Lalka (noble prize winning, sorry if you don't know it but it's super big deal in my country :P)

Video on publishing:

Lovecraft is a terrible example. The VAST majority of his fame didn't come until after he died. Also, he died broke and living in a shitty apartment barely getting by with what meagre earnings his stories brought him.

 

[nosinkarma]

I don't really have much idea on publishing, creative writing, webnovel industry. Heck I wrote 2 chapter's on a whim that too I haven't touched in 10 days, haven't edited them at all. I'm am simply procrastinating, making a excuse that I have job I have no time.
How can a guy who's play like 4-5hours of league everyday, not have time.


I have resolved to do so many things over the years yet failed to achieve them. Decided on a hobby but never achieved much.

Most of the time, the pattern to approach those task were same, you start something with immense 'bieginner excitement' then as you progress you realize that to get good you must put time and efforts. The constant commitment just makes you loose interest.

I have left many many hobbies half way due to this attitude and I have regretted it immensely. For real when I glance back five years back, all I see are those college years wasted.

I can assure you if you can just overcome this problem and still continue to write, regardless of how unrewarding it is, you are the one that will have that sweet sweet satisfaction years later.

Point is,
You start with motivation but continue with habit.
Just don't stop.

This all may sound cheesy and very idealistic but it works.

 

[Reisinling]

Lovecraft is a terrible example. The VAST majority of his fame didn't come until after he died. Also, he died broke and living in a shitty apartment barely getting by with what meagre earnings his stories brought him.

But that was my point- that writers don't become famous after showing a book to editor and being published- it is more of a lottery, and making any financial bets basing on it is naivee at best

 

[Deleted member 54065]

Yo, what happened, if I may? It's fine if it's too private or what, but I am also staying in the Philippines now, so it might be of concern.

PH Gov't hunting us teachers, lawyers and/or judges who help progressive groups or political activists that are against them.

Received multiple death threats last March, so I had to lie low for the meantime.

 

[Deleted member 53101]

PH Gov't hunting us teachers, lawyers and/or judges who help progressive groups or political activists that are against them.

Received multiple death threats last March, so I had to lie low for the meantime.

Need to remind, let's keep the thread out of politics. You can discuss that stuff on DM.