Is monetizing a fanfic wrong?

PrincessFelicie

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Legally speaking, I know it's enough of a grey area that Ao3 and ffnet don't allow you to monetize uploads of your fics on their platforms.

My personal take is Fanfic should totally be allowed to be monetized. It's what they do in Japan; the doujin scene is thriving. Fanart can be monetized, fanvids too, etc etc. Fanfiction is the only piece of fanmade content that gets this special standard forbidding monetization and it's nonsensical.
 

LostLibrarian

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My personal take is Fanfic should totally be allowed to be monetized. It's what they do in Japan; the doujin scene is thriving.
But the doujinshi scene is thriving because the companies allow for it. The creation and selling of it is still illegal by law. If any company decided to have a certain work taken down, that'll happen. There are cases where that happened.

But the manga/doujin-subculture as a whole decided that not going after it is the best way. A lot of famous mangaka started out doing (h) doujinshi, so they now turn a blind eye in the same way. Some of them even actively promote that creating stuff on their series to the point that there is a "doujinshi allowed" logo for it.


It's the same point of "no punishment without plaintiff". Just as many western game companies allow (or even ask) for Let's Plays, because they understand the overall value for the community. And in Japan it's the same. Going by their IP laws they could go crazy, but they actively decided not to...
 

Nakakure

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If you chinese, just monotize it. It already norm in there to make fanfic and sold it.
 

BenJepheneT

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So you're implying fan fiction writing isn't created from a person's skill? I know fan fiction gets a bad wrap for often being of questionable quality, but I put a lot of effort into mine. If we want to be technical about it, fan art is just as easy because there's a base to work from, like a pre-existing character design. But that's obviously not how it works. Just because fan fiction is taking someone else's work and creating something different with it, doesn't mean it's not a skill. A well done creation, regardless of whether it's fan art or fan fiction, takes skill.

I know it's an aside, but I was planning my Pokemon fan fiction 4 years before I actually started writing it. It took a lot of effort to get to the point where I am now, where I believe it to be relatively well written (and even now I'm editing parts that I think can be better). I couldn't just write whatever I wanted without justifying it, because the Pokemon world works a certain way. I needed to get my story to work within the limitations of what already exists. It's not exactly the easiest thing. It took skill to write a good fan fiction.
If that's how I came across, then you're mistaken. What I meant to say was that under the pretense of infringing someone else's original creation, fan fictions tends to be under fire more than graphical art. Art is an abstract thing, and thus inherently open to interpretation. That trait on of itself shields many fanarts out there from getting under legal fire. Fanfictions, on the other hand, requires usage of names and terms created by the original author themselves, in which it's WAY MORE EASIER to shout infringement than fanart. You could circumvent this by purposely NOT using their names, or writing in a different language, but between art and writing, I'd argue the one using language that can be objectively compared to one another is under more fire than the guy doing scribbles on paper.

The reason I said they're not in the same ballpark is because they're incomparable IF the original creator decides to fuck with the other guy. I never aimed to make any discussions regarding skills. I apologize for my poor usage of wording.
 

Horizon42

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Morally, it's fine to me. But I would just ask for tips since it's not technically monetizing the fanfic, instead it's more similar to street beggers (not to bang on anybody). Either way, it's legally questionable and it all depends on how much you want to protect yourself while making money.

But if it's anything japanese owned, then forget it. Those mofos are ruthless and do not care about the fan community whatsoever.
 

CupcakeNinja

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This forum seems to agree that stealing graphical art for covers is bad, but how about writing a fanfic and then commercializing it?

Does that break the law? If so, does SH allow it?

Are fanfics plagiarism? why not? Could I take a popular novel from SH and then write my fan-fic about it and then charge people for it?

(If you wonder why this isn't a poll, this is because people in this forum complain about blank 1* and 5* star ratings, so if you don't post anything, you don't have a right to be heard :blob_shade: )
You are creating new content. Just using old content as a base to build upon. It's fine. Who cares about morals? People will pay if they really like your work regardless. I say go ahead. Me, I may just monetize my existing works too. Why? Cuz daddy needs a good chair and I simp for pewdiepie so only a 399$ Clutch will do.

Also cuz I'm a lazy cunt and I have like five damn stories to write and I don't feel like doing it so if people really want me to write em to the extent they would buy me a soda as a bribe, well then fine. I'll write. But otherwise I dont really wanna. I made a mistake making so many stories lol

....what was this thread about? I kinda went off into a tangent. OH! Right. Fanfics. Anyway yeah it's fine fam. Just don't charge an arm and a leg for it lol.
 

SaddyStorm

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Plus, the original purpose of copyright is to encourage sharing of ideas and cultural advancement. Fair use, on the other hand, is created to counteract and limit copyright.
I think you got them mixed up here.
 

tarreb

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#NotALawyer
Is it morally wrong? I'll say it's kind of a gray area, and not really share an opinion

Is it potentially unlawful (with regards to US copyright) and open you to legal liabilities? Almost absolutely yes, unless your resultant work is actually fair use. (Unless it's a parody or critique, it probably isn't fair use.)

Is an author going to get sued for running a tip jar on a fanfic? I'd say the odds are pretty low, but it depends on how visible/popular your fanfic is.

So let's kill some pretty big misconceptions:

The "I'm only making a couple hundred bucks, it isn't worth it for X to sue me" rationality (Part 1):This may be true for most civil cases, in which a claimant can usually only sue for actual (provable) damages. US copyright law is one of the few circumstances in US civil law in which a claimant can instead request statutory damages. In layman's terms, instead of suing you for the value for a fixed value greater than the amount you potentially make based on the nature of the infringement. This can be between $750 and $30,000 per work with willful infringement resulting in damages up to $150,000, all at the court's discretion. Additionally, at the end of 2020 a law was passed that effectively creates a small claims court for copyright infringement. There are some questions on its constitutionality in terms of the way it was organized, but it likely reduces the expenses of attempting to file a claim against smaller infringers. This may encourage copyright holders to challenge smaller potential infringers, as doing so will be much cheaper than filing in federal court.

$100, part 2: Just because the cost of a case may exceed the payout does not always shield you from a lawsuit. There may be other factors at play. One might be that they follow through on a lawsuit in order to demonstrate that they control and protect their copyright. This can help the author in other instances of infringement for larger, more valuable infringers. Another reason might just be spite--the copyright holder is a litigious bastard and likes to sue people.

"It's fair use!": It probably isn't. Fair use determinations are extremely subjective, and at the mercy of whichever judge it comes before. Fair use gets tested against four factors. Read https://fairuse.stanford.edu/overview/fair-use/four-factors/ for a more in depth and authoritative source on this. By accepting payment for the potentially infringing work it becomes commercial in nature, which will help to weigh against a fair use claim.

"It's transformative!" (fair use pt.2): It probably isn't, or at least is not transformative enough. A simple fanfic that just takes existing characters and settings to tell a new story is generally not sufficiently transformative. This is typically the most important factor in a fair use defense and is also the hardest to define. The bar of being 'transformative enough' is nebulous, subjective, and particularly sensitive to the opinions of the judge.
 

tarreb

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Plus, the original purpose of copyright is to encourage sharing of ideas and cultural advancement. Fair use, on the other hand, is created to counteract and limit copyright.

I think you got them mixed up here.

Nah, Hans is actually spot on. Copyright was intended to encourage artists. While the laws have some problems and have not really adapted well or kept up with technology, they do still strive for that goal. The fair use doctrine is an adaptation of the courts that helps to prevent copyright law from being over-broad and self-sabotaging.

So how does copyright law encourage art? It incentivizes artists to create new works with the knowledge that they--and they alone--will be able to control who will potentially profit off the works of their labor. Without copyright, an author who writes a book could not control who publishes and sells that book. A malicious company could just copy the text and undercut the author. In such a case, there is no incentive to actually create new art because an artist would not actually be able to make a living.
 
D

Deleted member 45782

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This forum seems to agree that stealing graphical art for covers is bad, but how about writing a fanfic and then commercializing it?

Does that break the law? If so, does SH allow it?

Are fanfics plagiarism? why not? Could I take a popular novel from SH and then write my fan-fic about it and then charge people for it?

(If you wonder why this isn't a poll, this is because people in this forum complain about blank 1* and 5* star ratings, so if you don't post anything, you don't have a right to be heard :blob_shade: )
Yes, it is wrong. Your characters and the fanfic of a story basically pulls characters from another writer's story. You draw readers into your fanfic story because of the original author's work (if they did not create that story and their story wasn't beloved by many, there wouldn't be a fanfic for that story in the first place. so it is piggybacking off of the original author's work).

You want to take a popular novel from SH and write a fan-fic and charge it? Ask permission. Ask if the original SH wrote their story for free. And the question that might come up is: why should you charge other people if its based off of another person's story.

Unless you completely change your fanfic until its completely and totally different that you can't even tell how it was inspired or made a fanfic of the original story (like how 50 Shades of Grey was originally a fanfic of Twilight, but got turned into something...else. And Cassandra Claire I heard her stories were originally Harry Potter fanfic, but because it was so different, she basically removed any related names and stuff from her story, and it was able to stand out on its own and become a success.).

But those are some rare exceptions, and forgive if I'm wrong since (I don't really read fanfics), but in a lot of cases' fanfic is basically what could happen if that character or story was on a different path. It basically doesn't completely change things that you can't tell where it was a derivative from and its pull fans from not its own base like those stories above (the latter has its own fanbase), but its pulling fanbase from a different person's work.

You're better off writing your own original work and then commercializing it.

You could face some legal trouble down the road if you monetize off a fanfic. You did a lot of work in that writing, but a derivative is still a derivative and pulls from another fanbase to your work. If you say your story other than the names and a few characters is pretty much original itself cause you wrote it out and everything is basically different from the original story you're making a fanfic on, then remove those similar/same things and turn it into something original, something that you won't face legal trouble on and can be proud to say its your original work, rather than its my fanfic of this [author's work].

Don't go commercializing someone else's work, because if your story is a fanfic, it still a derivative of their work. Especially if you don't get permission. Cause it'll feel like a rip-off to the original author's work if you did it (and keep in mind some people come to Scribblehub to just write for free and now you're gonna bank on their work?).

I disagree. You do have a right to be heard regardless if you post anything to this forum or not; this is for the whole Scribblehub community (readers, forum seekers, feedback, etc.).
 
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K5Rakitan

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I would make money on it if I could. Personally, I believe that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, and I would be totally flattered if someone wanted to grab my characters and play with them. I use characters from Yu-Gi-Oh! because they inspire me, but I have several "original" characters as well.

Before Wattpad kicked me off the site, I did inspire someone. It's not fanfiction like my story, and it definitely has plenty of unique elements, but just the general concept of having a whore for a protagonist helped inspire this story:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/202642886-the-year-package-✔

In turn, I was also partially inspired by this author:


And I'd also like to thank my clients and husband and boyfriends and pretty much everyone I've ever met who served as inspiration :s_wink:
I don't believe there are any truly original ideas out there, so why bother?

I've considered pulling a "50 Shades" with my story, but I'm not ready to let go of Seto and Mokuba Kaiba just yet.
 
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D

Deleted member 45782

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I would make money on it if I could. Personally, I believe that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, and I would be totally flattered if someone wanted to grab my characters and play with them. I use characters from Yu-Gi-Oh! because they inspire me, but I have several "original" characters as well.

Before Wattpad kicked me off the site, I did inspire someone. It's not fanfiction like my story, and it definitely has plenty of unique elements, but just the general concept of having a whore for a protagonist helped inspire this story:
https://www.wattpad.com/story/202642886-the-year-package-✔

In turn, I was also partially inspired by this author:


And I'd also like to thank my clients and husband and boyfriends and pretty much everyone I've ever met who served as inspiration :s_wink:
I don't believe there are any truly original ideas out there, so why bother?

I've considered pulling a "50 Shades" with my story, but I'm not ready to let go of Seto and Mokuba Kaiba just yet.
I think there's a difference between inspiration and then having stories with characters with same name, from same universe type of thing. I'm glad you're able to inspire a few people though.

I think "there's no original thing anymore" has been overused a lot, quite frankly i see it on r/writing too. Yes, there's always something inspired us. A lot of things have already been done and said and i agree with that. But i think there's a lot of good stories that are also out there that come with unique new twists. Same story, same chords, but told in a different way. Stories and tech do not stay the same, there's always something new added in that allows us to keep evolving and making new twists.

To me, a fanfic is still a derivative. Before readers get pulled into your writing, they get pulled in by it being a fanfic of another story.
 

thedude3445

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I'm glad everyone already beat me to the punch with this thread and everyone is on the same page. It's not "morally wrong" or anything to sell a fan work but it sure is illegal, and fair use probably won't protect you either.

You just gotta make sure you make fan fiction only of public domain work. Wuthering Heights on Another World, the new hit isekai, followed up by Little Women Online, everyone's favorite new VRMMO LitRPG.
 

Ai-chan

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This forum seems to agree that stealing graphical art for covers is bad, but how about writing a fanfic and then commercializing it?

Does that break the law? If so, does SH allow it?

Are fanfics plagiarism? why not? Could I take a popular novel from SH and then write my fan-fic about it and then charge people for it?

(If you wonder why this isn't a poll, this is because people in this forum complain about blank 1* and 5* star ratings, so if you don't post anything, you don't have a right to be heard :blob_shade: )
Does that break the law? Strictly speaking, yes. Any fanfiction breaks copyright law by default, unless you can get written permission from the copyright owner to make money with it. That's why in some countries, storysites that allow fanfiction to be posted specifically mention that they are only a story archives site and do not take responsibility for the contents posted by users, which includes propaganda, politics, fanfiction, eroticism or any other content that could land them in hot water.

Are fanfics plagiarism? Strictly speaking, not necessarily. You see, plagiarism is when you take someone else's work and claim that it's yours. Fanfiction breaks copyright, but it's not necessarily plagiarism. After all, you are only taking the universe, the setting, the characters and the plot and use your own words to write the story. You still recognize it as a fanfiction and while it breaks copyright law and you can still get in trouble for it, it's not plagiarism.

Can you take a popular novel from SH, write fanfic and then charge people for it? The answer is you can, but you should not, because that's totally illegal. It's also a douche move that shits on that author.

You see, there is this unspoken rule with fanfics. Authors ignore fanfictions, as long as you don't make money from it. You're probably saying, "But that's a moot point, right? If I don't make money from it, then they have no case against me." That's the wrong assumption.

The moment you write and post a fanfic, you are already breaking copyright law, breaking the most basic of which all modern copyright law is derived from, which is the Berne Convention For The Protection of Literary and Artistic Works. This means that if authors want to take you to court for your fanfic, they can and depending on the case, they would win. Why people still write fanfics? Because authors decide to ignore the existence of fanfics.

But if you sell your fanfic, they can sue you for damages. How much you will be sued? It depends mostly on how much they can wring out from you or on how much they think they have lost income from your fanfic. So best not to do it.

What is allowed however, is homage. Explaining this will make this post longer, so it's best that you research it yourself.
 
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