Why do you think JP novel authors always write inconsistent beta-characters? Especially fantasies

[AetherialCore]

Yeah, but it's only one thing out of many I mentioned, and I thought you knew what pg stands for. It's also about violence, curse words, etc. I only mentioned sex separately because it is connected to MC being a beta or alpha.

Understandable, have a great day.

pst, it's the tone. IT'S THE TONE!

 

[BenJepheneT]

Beta characters, or what you describe as, are the BEST template character for any writer to start with. They begin the story from rock bottom with no courage, little power, and most of the time, are nothing more than fish out of water in a scenario that's not exclusive to isekai. If we were to look at JP novel landscapes (at least the mainstream shounen market) before Mushoku Tensei Ruined A Whole Generation of Light Novels, it's mostly the same timid protagonists navigating through a harem/underworld/what-have-you.

The reason for this is simple: you literally have nowhere else to go but up. Simply put your character to trials and tribulations; plot armour optional but recommended, have him learn basic human bravery, and chalk that up as character development. Have that "look at your fist downwards intently" moment to signify that your MC isn't a blank slate, and then rinse + repeat for 6 more arcs until your series inevitably ends/gets axed.

Hell, if you want your MC to take the villain route, it's totally explained too. They start off cowardly and scared anyway. They're about one bad day away from going postal, and for the author, that's as simple as building a scene and writing it down.

Beta MCs are prevalent throughout JP novels not because they're a good troupe but because they're a good foundation brimming with potential. The good thing about starting with nothing is that you have everything to gain. Unless you fuck that up, then I don't know how you landed this job in the first place.

 

[Hence]

Understandable, have a great day.

pst, it's the tone. IT'S THE TONE!

This dude is being SARCASTIC

It made me LMFAO

Beta characters, or what you describe as, are the BEST template character for any writer to start with. They begin the story from rock bottom with no courage, little power, and most of the time, are nothing more than fish out of water in a scenario that's not exclusive to isekai. If we were to look at JP novel landscapes (at least the mainstream shounen market) before Mushoku Tensei Ruined A Whole Generation of Light Novels, it's mostly the same timid protagonists navigating through a harem/underworld/what-have-you.

The reason for this is simple: you literally have nowhere else to go but up. Simply put your character to trials and tribulations; plot armour optional but recommended, have him learn basic human bravery, and chalk that up as character development. Have that "look at your fist downwards intently" moment to signify that your MC isn't a blank slate, and then rinse + repeat for 6 more arcs until your series inevitably ends/gets axed.

Hell, if you want your MC to take the villain route, it's totally explained too. They start off cowardly and scared anyway. They're about one bad day away from going postal, and for the author, that's as simple as building a scene and writing it down.

Beta MCs are prevalent throughout JP novels not because they're a good troupe but because they're a good foundation brimming with potential. The good thing about starting with nothing is that you have everything to gain. Unless you fuck that up, then I don't know how you landed this job in the first place.

Hahahahah, you explained it magnificently... but the reality is very different...
They literally 'exploit' that kind of troupe

 

[Lloyd]

America nuked Japan into submission then their new constitution was written by a feminist. Their masculine spirit has been completely and utterly destroyed.

 

[SailusGebel]

America nuked Japan into submission then their new constitution was written by a feminist. Their masculine spirit has been completely and utterly destroyed.

 

[Hence]

America nuked Japan into submission then their new constitution was written by a feminist. Their masculine spirit has been completely and utterly destroyed.

BONK!!!!

 

[TheEldritchGod]

You write what you know, then keep writing what sells.

 

[lnv]

You know Jp novels always got a massive advantage when it comes to novels.... Yet despite that. despite the always NEW and INTERESTING PREMISE, COLORFUL ART, MASSIVE AUDIENCE.... These goddamnnnn for sake authors Always try'na made the MC a LITERALLLLL BETA MC. Name it- Op but ignorant, Illogical harem, Hypocritical Mc, Brain ded, Always bow to literal anyone, Spineless, World with no common sense, A Denser than the black hole MC
( like for example, on a certain novel that i forgot, There's that 6 years old mc with harem, member of the harem are similar age of his, Then erotic scene...bruh, author is clearly a pedophile bastard)

Wut else....?..... Hmmmm
Ah yes, Slave to girls, Deux ex machina, Dick-less bs, jiggling loli, So kind~ so ducking KIND, As always... The MC Is always average. Specially the face.... Meh


I have read lot of novels, at one time I've come to love them. But as i experienced reading a novel with full-proof plot and interaction, i had realize how brain ded the Average Jp novel is

It is a result of Japanese culture which require that people be "humble". Add in a long history of novels and isolated community has made tropes dominate the novels.

Everything else as mention is escapism where isekai is like their vacation. Do understand, their audience isn't you but Otakus.

I will also mention MC is never average, only claims to be.

You know i would rather read a Chinese face slapping novel than those dick-less kind mc. -atleast i can experienced the taste of the villain drinking it's own medicine than The MC who just forgive The VILLAIN.

Both are bad. Face slapping is nice after you read a lot of JP, but once you read a lot of CN you also get frustrated with rabid dogs who kill people who didn't even do much wrong. The MC is often times no better than the villain. It just feels fresh cause it is new to you, give it a few more years and it'll be just as annoying as JP.

So guys. Why do you think they still continued to write a novel thats clearly inconsistent and illogical novel in the first place? -despite it's interesting premise?

Because it sells to otaku audiences? Back in the day I always wondered, why do the poorly rated harem animes get multiple seasons, but good animes rarely do. That is because harem animes are easy to make, and have lots of merchandising to otaku crowds. In comparison, good anime need high budgets and don't easily pay for themselves.

Is it becuz they target the market of Kids? If so, can they atleast made them readable for older audience?

They do make them more for older generations, notice the isekai trend has moved more away from high schoolers to middle aged people being isekaid?

What do you guys think?
They should atleast knew the Obvious Plot hole yes?
They should atleast knew how illogical the world and character yes?

This is a problem of copy and pasting tropes. Not to mention most light novels originate from web novels and were written by amateurs.

 

[CupcakeNinja]

Quite a simple reasom

Escapism.



Like. It is impossible to describe in words how stressful the environment and culture is for the JP people, both the students and the workforce.

So, it is really a refreshing moment when you can just shut your mind off and go back to the days of watching power rangers where every monster was killed in one blast.

There is also self projection, it is incredible to imagine yourself as the MC.

Unfortunately, real life men don't know how to talk to girls, hence the MC are often such betas.

And it's nice to tell yourself it's alright to be beta because women who like betas exist,

no, lets not use escapism as an excuse for shitty writing.

 

[Bartun]

Well, I don't like this whole thing of "alphas" and "betas" but anyway. I wouldn't want to read about the OP hardcore "alpha" character who is perfect in every way. They get to f*ck all the girls and get all the riches. No struggle at all. Plus they make him a know-it-all who is always a step ahead of his enemies. Seems boring. Why would you want to read that?

The alternative seems more interesting, even if you don't like this "beta" MC. As many other people already said, he can only go up, right? Besides, the culture in Japan is completely different from us in the West, they do things differently and they don't see being overly "nice" as a bad thing as we do, but as a virtue. They also have deeply ingrained the destiny/reincarnation thing, so tropes like "childhood friends" or fated meetings that are meh for us are a huge thing for them. In their culture, being "alpha" is wrong. Just think about it, the stereotypical "alphas" "chads" "winners" and "f*ckboys" that people not so secretly fantasize to be here in the West are also the stereotypical Japanese delinquent, the kind of guy you constantly see Japanese MCs saving girls from.

Japanese have a duty to their society, and unlike here in the West, being hardworking and respectful is rewarded by women. Japanese women are constant victims of slut-shaming so it's only natural for them to marry at an early age. They don't even care about money as we do, is not uncommon for men to "marry up". Being a "simp" is not frowned upon either as being a dedicated partner is a virtue for Japanese society. Why there is an abundance of "betas" and "simp" characters in anime, manga, and Light novels? Simple. Because Japanse like that stuff and BUY that stuff.

But what do I know, anyway? I'm just a dinosaur.

 

[BlackKnightX]

Simple, really. First of all, the author is a spineless pussy who wants to write something to escape the reality, so he starts by self-inserting himself into the story, making himself the protagonist—maybe not completely—thus, the reason why the protagonist is a spineless pussy, also. When this spineless pussy author creates the spineless pussy mc and gains massive success and popularity, I think you can guess what’s transpired. Yes, the audience is also a bunch of spineless pussies—no offense—or a bunch of kiddies. The spineless pussy author sees such a success so he keeps on producing escapist stories with spineless pussy protagonists to maximize the profit. Thus, the cycle of spineless pussy.

 

[Reinya]

on that note, can anyone recommend something similar like Kanna no Kanna, title with normal interactions and mc

 

[Hence]

Simple, really. First of all, the author is a spineless pussy who wants to write something to escape the reality, so he starts by self-inserting himself into the story, making himself the protagonist—maybe not completely—thus, the reason why the protagonist is a spineless pussy, also. When this spineless pussy author creates the spineless pussy mc and gains massive success and popularity, I think you can guess what’s transpired. Yes, the audience is also a bunch of spineless pussies—no offense—or a bunch of kiddies. The spineless pussy author sees such a success so he keeps on producing escapist stories with spineless pussy protagonists to maximize the profit. Thus, the cycle of spineless pussy.

It seems like you had not found a "decent" CHAD mc.... Here-

Inside An Adult Game As A Former Hero

Inside An Adult Game As A Former Hero

www.foxaholic.com

Thank me later mate

 

[NitroxDarks]

Japan has a culture of relying on others. The man would rely on their boss, wife, mother and father and even sibling or coworkers.

I think it hits them the most since it's so close to their own reality and they don't see that as weird. Slave mentality? To a certain extent, sure but not really.

 

[BlackKnightX]

Why would you want to read that?

You’ve already stated the reasons a few sentences earlier.

 

[ElliePorter]

You know most Japanese people don't know the meaning of Day Off and sometimes, they do have off days but they work in a black company and they are called to report in.

Escapism is the probably the number one reason for their writing agendas. Imagine working in a monotonous job for 9 - 5 or sometimes longer than that and you're stuck in a cubicle hell.

 

[expentio]

This might be the reason why I at some point completely settled on female MCs (which has many downsides in terms of variety).
At one point every hero kinda felt like a trope. Either the self-righteous hero who always knows better and settly by the world's will is also better or a weak to strong MC destined to succeed in one way or the other. It kinda felt like a template that's always leading to the same result.
With female MCs I can at least feel a bït of emotion. (Though the tropes are getting worse here.)

 

[SternenklarenRitter]

Because mild mannered protagonists are more likeable? About the bowing in particular though, a bow is like a handshake in Japan. Everyone bows to each other without thinking anything of it. The different kinds of bows basically could count as their own language. For a Japanese, talking without bows is like speaking English without ever using the word 'the.' But often protagonists are very inconsistent indeed. It is frustrating when a protagonist previously presented as sympathetic mercilessly and coldly seeks out and kills adversaries they could have easily pacified or avoided instead. Also self described "mommas boys" spend 25% less time on tinder because they find girlfriends faster, so a beta harem protagonist is actually realistic.

 

[ConansWitchBaby]

What about the constant, trying to bang 12-15 year olds?

 

[SternenklarenRitter]

What about the constant, trying to bang 12-15 year olds?

Yeah that, is a problem. But I don't see it as particularly prominant one, having dropped nearly a dozen stories for having rapist protagonists, compared to only two or three for having child molester protagonists. It may be in part an artifact stemming from how more ero gets translated than safe for work stories.