I Spat On The Eye of The God

[SailusGebel]

Hmm, you've been talking about the art a lot, but that's not the only points that I brought. I wrote two pages worth of script about the bad points of Solo, how cliche it was and how badly written the characters were. For one, I haven't seen many people talk about these points.

I don't think I've talked about art that much. I wanted to mention some works with great art. Anyway, back to the main topic. I started this dialogue with the sole purpose of comprehending things I don't understand. To do this, I wanted to hear your opinion.

 

[gaylolis]

Oh, the I spat on the eye of the god, is just because of how cultlike Solo Leveling's following is. Those guys will mess you up, man.

sounds like west taiwan fanboys

 

[BenJepheneT]

sounds like west taiwan fanboys

West Taiwan? More like

动态网自由门 天安門 天安门 法輪功 李洪志 Free Tibet 六四天安門事件 The Tiananmen Square protests of 1989 天安門大屠殺 The Tiananmen Square Massacre 反右派鬥爭 The Anti-Rightist Struggle 大躍進政策 The Great Leap Forward 文化大革命 The Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution 人權 Human Rights 民運 Democratization 自由 Freedom 獨立 Independence 多黨制 Multi-party system 台灣 臺灣 Taiwan Formosa 中華民國 Republic of China 西藏 土伯特 唐古特 Tibet 達賴喇嘛 Dalai Lama 法輪功 Falun Dafa 新疆維吾爾自治區 The Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region 諾貝爾和平獎 Nobel Peace Prize 劉暁波 Liu Xiaobo 民主 言論 思想 反共 反革命 抗議 運動 騷亂 暴亂 騷擾 擾亂 抗暴 平反 維權 示威游行 李洪志 法輪大法 大法弟子 強制斷種 強制堕胎 民族淨化 人體實驗 肅清 胡耀邦 趙紫陽 魏京生 王丹 還政於民 和平演變 激流中國 北京之春 大紀元時報 九評論共産黨 獨裁 專制 壓制 統一 監視 鎮壓 迫害 侵略 掠奪 破壞 拷問 屠殺 活摘器官 誘拐 買賣人口 遊進 走私 毒品 賣淫 春畫 賭博 六合彩 天安門 天安门 法輪功 李洪志 Winnie the Pooh 劉曉波动态网自由门

 

[Angry_Clown]

@BenJepheneT

 

[BenJepheneT]

@BenJepheneT

 

[Angry_Clown]

@BenJepheneT, ah yes, the sponsor bit at the end of youtube vids. What's next, Assault: Shade Stories?

 

[Maple-Leaf]

Well clearly disliking Solo Leveling isn't a very uncommon opinion.

 

[Discount_Blade]

I've never understood the popularity of it. There's nothing unique or special about it. Take out the art and it would only be good enough to be considered a dime novel, you know those thin paperback books you see in grocery store aisles in the magazine sections or near the registers? The MC is a blatant carbon copy of Mr. Average, has no redeeming qualities beyond what you would expect from a random checklist of "heroic traits".

The plotline is easily predicted. The character's actions are uninspiring. It's literally ONLY the art that propels this story ANYWHERE. I mean take away the art and this story would be buried in the abyss of countless other boring novels on NU. It's sad that people fall for "pretty pictures and bright flashing lights" but they do. As consumers, the vast majority of us are extremely easily manipulated to look past otherwise terrible flaws because something bright and shiny included in an otherwise, blatantly faulty product held our attention long enough to make us 'forget' those blatantly obvious flaws.

Also, I would like to argue against people who claim Solo Leveling pushed the manwha/webcomic scene to the forefront of the masses. I would give that particular trophy to Tower of God. At least that's all I ever heard about from various circles that got me interested in manwha. I now find Korean comics far superior to anything Chinese/Japanese. The only thing Korean comics can't seem to do, is tell a happy romance story without chucking shitloads of NTR down the readers throat before we finally get a satisfying happy ending. Even if it isn't the main female lead getting ntr'd....SOMEONE SOMEWHERE in that story is and the author makes sure to display it in all it's obvious detail. Them Koreans love NTR for whatever reason.

 

[SailusGebel]

I've never understood the popularity of it. There's nothing unique or special about it. Take out the art and it would only be good enough to be considered a dime novel, you know those thin paperback books you see in grocery store aisles in the magazine sections or near the registers? The MC is a blatant carbon copy of Mr. Average, has no redeeming qualities beyond what you would expect from a random checklist of "heroic traits".

The plotline is easily predicted. The character's actions are uninspiring. It's literally ONLY the art that propels this story ANYWHERE. I mean take away the art and this story would be buried in the abyss of countless other boring novels on NU. It's sad that people fall for "pretty pictures and bright flashing lights" but they do. As consumers, the vast majority of us are extremely easily manipulated to look past otherwise terrible flaws because something bright and shiny included in an otherwise, blatantly faulty product held our attention long enough to make us 'forget' those blatantly obvious flaws.

You forgot one more thing that made it popular. Memes.

 

[Discount_Blade]

You forgot one more thing that made it popular. Memes.

Yeah that too. I think the meme thing has gone too far. I find myself shying away from any series heavily meme'd because I've discoverd that that I often find myself at odd's with what is considered "popular" and "mainstream". Does that make me a wannabe hispter? A poser? If you want to think so than you have that right. No skin off my nuts. To me, when you get a bunch of people together to discuss ANYTHING, I mean more than just 3-4 people, collective IQ's plummet.

 

[Maple-Leaf]

I don't get why only good art makes it any less genuinely successful, or why it should be sad that people like it only because of that. Even if the quality is only upheld because of art, the fact that it's managed to get so popular is still impressive. Stop being salty and write something so good it doesn't even need good art. And I came there purely for an OP mc and was willing to ignore anything and everything else, so it met my expectations, I guess.

Also, I feel like we're getting off topic here.

 

[SailusGebel]

I don't get why only good art makes it any less genuinely successful, or why it should be sad that people like it only because of that. Even if the quality is only upheld because of art, the fact that it's managed to get so popular is still impressive. Stop being salty and write something so good it doesn't even need good art. And I came there purely for an OP mc and was willing to ignore anything and everything else, so it met my expectations, I guess.

Also, I feel like we're getting off topic here.

It's bad because the art will cater to the masses as well. Art of such level is converted into money. Do masses like the best things there are on the market? I don't know. Also, there are lots of works with art just as good as in Solo Leveling and a good story. Yet these stories are not so popular. Why? Is it fair? Once again, I don't know. However, it is painful when such works get axed or discontinued because of the low reader base. I understand that it isn't solely the fault of 'bad readers' that have no taste. But you can't deny it either. They are a part of a reason why good works get forgotten.

 

[Yorth]

I've never understood the popularity of it. There's nothing unique or special about it. Take out the art and it would only be good enough to be considered a dime novel, you know those thin paperback books you see in grocery store aisles in the magazine sections or near the registers? The MC is a blatant carbon copy of Mr. Average, has no redeeming qualities beyond what you would expect from a random checklist of "heroic traits".

The plotline is easily predicted. The character's actions are uninspiring. It's literally ONLY the art that propels this story ANYWHERE. I mean take away the art and this story would be buried in the abyss of countless other boring novels on NU. It's sad that people fall for "pretty pictures and bright flashing lights" but they do. As consumers, the vast majority of us are extremely easily manipulated to look past otherwise terrible flaws because something bright and shiny included in an otherwise, blatantly faulty product held our attention long enough to make us 'forget' those blatantly obvious flaws.

Also, I would like to argue against people who claim Solo Leveling pushed the manwha/webcomic scene to the forefront of the masses. I would give that particular trophy to Tower of God. At least that's all I ever heard about from various circles that got me interested in manwha. I now find Korean comics far superior to anything Chinese/Japanese. The only thing Korean comics can't seem to do, is tell a happy romance story without chucking shitloads of NTR down the readers throat before we finally get a satisfying happy ending. Even if it isn't the main female lead getting ntr'd....SOMEONE SOMEWHERE in that story is and the author makes sure to display it in all it's obvious detail. Them Koreans love NTR for whatever reason.

The title of "pushing manhwa to the forefront" isn't a unique one, but still. Let me show you how mind-blowingly popular Solo Leveling is.

This is google trends, a website that shows how popular a search term is. Here we see that before the Tower of God anime hype, solo leveling was topping the chart compared to any other manhwa/webtoon. And we can see that once the hype died, SL was back on top of the chart. Now, you can imagine what would happen once a Solo Leveling anime is announced/aired.

 

[Maple-Leaf]

It's bad because the art will cater to the masses as well. Art of such level is converted into money. Do masses like the best things there are on the market? I don't know. Also, there are lots of works with art just as good as in Solo Leveling and a good story. Yet these stories are not so popular. Why? Is it fair? Once again, I don't know. However, it is painful when such works get axed or discontinued because of the low reader base. I understand that it isn't solely the fault of 'bad readers' that have no taste. But you can't deny it either. They are a part of a reason why good works get forgotten.

But then what defines good works? Popularity? Then Solo Leveling might as well be called a masterpiece. The characters? People's love for any character is based purely on their own opinion and any protagonist can be the scummiest person on earth and still have people who love them. A story getting deleted or canceled shouldn't be a sign of fault in other peoples tastes and the unjustness of a different one being popular, it's a mess up in the author or creator's part. If everyone could agree that this "great work" was wonderful and brilliant, whether it be in art or plot, then it wouldn't have a low reader base. It's all just opinions in the end, and solo leveling being popular because in a large group of people's' opinions it's great, isn't some kind of injustice to works a different group of people consider superior.

I agree, it would suck if making a story popular boiled down to just having good art, because it would bury people who don't have access to that kind of thing. But I also don't think good art should be dismissed as a quality to a good work.

 

[Discount_Blade]

I don't get why only good art makes it any less genuinely successful, or why it should be sad that people like it only because of that. Even if the quality is only upheld because of art, the fact that it's managed to get so popular is still impressive. Stop being salty and write something so good it doesn't even need good art. And I came there purely for an OP mc and was willing to ignore anything and everything else, so it met my expectations, I guess.

Also, I feel like we're getting off topic here.

I wasn't being salty. Everything I said in everyone of my posts were my opinion. I truly believe what I said. That's not being salty. That's giving an opinion. To me, you seem to be the salty one just by the fact that you accused someone else of being so. And yes, when a literary item is only popular because of it's art, it DOES make it less genuine. Because pictures aren't literary. Literary means words. That should seem obvious. It's popular yes. But the literary side of it is subpar, and this at best. It being a webnovel/webcomic puts it into a gray area regarding literary classifications, but as far as the written word goes, it's quite obvious that it wasn't its written form that made it popular. It was the art. The Illustrations. Not the written part of the story itself.

For another thing, I'm not insulting the author. He made something and got rich doing it. Great. I praise the guy. HE's a success and I wish him the best for it. The world will always need more successful writers even if I find their work to be shit myself. Writing, the act of the written word, SHOULD NEVER DIE even if it's quality diminishes. So I'm not insulting him, I'm insulting the story he made based on my opinions. And yes there is a difference so let's not rehash that particularly exhausted argument that insulting the book written by the author is automatically insulting the author themselves because it isn't and I'm disgusted with people who try and conflate the two.

If that makes me salty, than everyone in the world who has an opinion contrary to anyone else is salty. Meaning the entire Human race is collectively salty. We should all probably drink more water than. Dehydration should be rampant.

 

[Maple-Leaf]

I wasn't being salty. Everything I said in everyone of my posts were my opinion. I truly believe what I said. That's not being salty. That's giving an opinion. To me, you seem to be the salty one just by the fact that you accused someone else of being so. And yes, when a literary item is only popular because of it's art, it DOES make it less genuine. Because pictures aren't literary. Literary means words. That should seem obvious. It's popular yes. But the literary side of it is subpar, and this at best. It being a webnovel/webcomic puts it into a gray area regarding literary classifications, but as far as the written word goes, it's quite obvious that it wasn't its written form that made it popular. It was the art. The Illustrations. Not the written part of the story itself.

I mean sure, if you want to separate it that clearly, that's fine and there's nothing wrong with disliking it because you don't like the literary side of the work. To me, you just came off as salty because you were angry that something that doesn't fit your standards for a good literary piece has gotten so popular, and that bugged me. I don't know what you intended to point out except "Solo Leveling is bad and it's sad that people like it." which isn't necessarily a bad to say if phrased properly, but they way you wrote it certainly seemed salty to me. *shakes salt*

Also can we talk about the memes? Maybe it's just the ones I've seen, but they kinda suck. Did I find the wrong ones or something?

 

[Discount_Blade]

I mean sure, if you want to separate it that clearly, that's fine and there's nothing wrong with disliking it because you don't like the literary side of the work. To me, you just came off as salty because you were angry that something that doesn't fit your standards for a good literary piece has gotten so popular, and that bugged me. I don't know what you intended to point out except "Solo Leveling is bad and it's sad that people like it." which isn't necessarily a bad to say if phrased properly, but they way you wrote it certainly seemed salty to me. *shakes salt*

Also can we talk about the memes? Maybe it's just the ones I've seen, but they kinda suck. Did I find the wrong ones or something?

Sure. We have different views on the words expressed. I apologize if I came off wrong.

And as for the memes....to me when a work starts getting popular to the point the memes get out of hand....to me that spells doom. I mean their are exceptions....like ONe-Punch-man that someone else in this thread mentioned....but Solo Leveling just didn't get it's meme game down proper. Should get some tips from the One-Punch peeps.

Hold up, lemme find some examples.

 

[SailusGebel]

But then what defines good works? Popularity? Then Solo Leveling might as well be called a masterpiece. The characters? People's love for any character is based purely on their own opinion and any protagonist can be the scummiest person on earth and still have people who love them. A story getting deleted or canceled shouldn't be a sign of fault in other peoples tastes and the unjustness of a different one being popular, it's a mess up in the author or creator's part. If everyone could agree that this "great work" was wonderful and brilliant, whether it be in art or plot, then it wouldn't have a low reader base. It's all just opinions in the end, and solo leveling being popular because in a large group of people's' opinions it's great, isn't some kind of injustice to works a different group of people consider superior.

I agree, it would suck if making a story popular boiled down to just having good art, because it would bury people who don't have access to that kind of thing. But I also don't think good art should be dismissed as a quality to a good work.

I would like to say that I'm not trying to insult or argue with you. Though, I may be bad at explaining things in English.
I don't know what defines a good work. It's subjective no matter what we do. However, we can still judge a part of said work. We can say that we like\think this work is good, yet we as well can say that a particular part of this work is bad. For example a game. We can say that gameplay is addictive while the story is garbage. The design and music are ok and in the end, we judge the game to be great. Why? Because for said person gameplay is more important. Yet he doesn't deny that the story is bad. The other thing that I want to add, is manga\webtoons are a combination of art and story. The story may be good, but if the art is terrible it will lose to a more mediocre one. The one that has both parts somewhere in between the good and bad. We shouldn't dismiss the good art. And I've not seen anyone who said the art in Solo Leveling is bad. However, this is a complex thing. It's a combination of art and story. And if you dismiss that the story part sucks, then you can just enjoy paintings instead of the manhwa. If a complex thing gets attention because of a single feature it doesn't negate all the things it sucks at.

For me Solo Leveling is hollow. I've read maybe twenty chapters before I got bored and dropped it. Yeah, the art is great, it was the thing that made me read it in the first place. However, when I've got my share of great art what were the things that I was left with?

I disagree with the point that good things wouldn't have a low reader base. I think there are a lot of different examples of how good works were overshadowed by those more popular. I can give you examples if you want.

"I agree, it would suck if making a story popular boiled down to just having good art, because it would bury people who don't have access to that kind of thing." In the end, this is how I see Solo Leveling. It's a hollow webtoon\manhwa, that overshadows everything because of the great art. It doesn't mean I'm right with how I see things. But I involuntarily connect this with good works being axed.

 

[Discount_Blade]

The very first meme on my search engine page. I'm assuming that means it's the most shared? IDk.

As far as solo-eveling meme's....this face is the most used one ever. It probably makes up 50-60% of all solo leveling memes.

I kinda like this one though since it add one-punchman into it.

Now for ONe-punchman

I do admit the "Ok" one punch meme's are starting to get obnoxious but i like this one.

Also i don't know why the size for these were reduced. I couldn't get it to not do that. Hope you can still read them.

 

[Maple-Leaf]

I would like to say that I'm not trying to insult or argue with you. Though, I may be bad at explaining things in English.
I don't know what defines a good work. It's subjective no matter what we do. However, we can still judge a part of said work. We can say that we like\think this work is good, yet we as well can say that a particular part of this work is bad. For example a game. We can say that gameplay is addictive while the story is garbage. The design and music are ok and in the end, we judge the game to be great. Why? Because for said person gameplay is more important. Yet he doesn't deny that the story is bad. The other thing that I want to add, is manga\webtoons are a combination of art and story. The story may be good, but if the art is terrible it will lose to a more mediocre one. The one that has both parts somewhere in between the good and bad. We shouldn't dismiss the good art. And I've not seen anyone who said the art in Solo Leveling is bad. However, this is a complex thing. It's a combination of art and story. And if you dismiss that the story part sucks, then you can just enjoy paintings instead of the manhwa. If a complex thing gets attention because of a single feature it doesn't negate all the things it sucks at.

For me Solo Leveling is hollow. I've read maybe twenty chapters before I got bored and dropped it. Yeah, the art is great, it was the thing that made me read it in the first place. However, when I've got my share of great art what were the things that I was left with?

I disagree with the point that good things wouldn't have a low reader base. I think there are a lot of different examples of how good works were overshadowed by those more popular. I can give you examples if you want.

"I agree, it would suck if making a story popular boiled down to just having good art, because it would bury people who don't have access to that kind of thing." In the end, this is how I see Solo Leveling. It's a hollow webtoon\manhwa, that overshadows everything because of the great art. It doesn't mean I'm right with how I see things. But I involuntarily connect this with good works being axed.

I think I saw it as good because I didn't have any particular problems with the story (I have low standards like that.), and the art certainly helped. Or maybe good art went well with the bad story? Because I don't enjoy looking at paintings very much. Maybe I just have a preference for nice hot garbage seasoned with very tasty sauce.